What, me... speechless?
by DrewsLions on Oct 29, 2008 2:55 PM EDT
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PrintI'm sure that you've all seen the TV show Seinfeld - dubbed by critics as "the show about nothing", right? Well, this might be the fanpost dubbed "the post about nothing". The traffic on the Lions blog sites have gone from an onslaught of frustration-laden posts to a trickle of comments here and there. It's because there is nothing left to write or talk about for the most part. The season's over. We know we have two first round picks next year - and one will be a top three. No news there. We all know that Stanton needs to play. It's been discussed at length on every blog and every major news outlet in Michigan. We all pretty much know that Marinelli needs to be fired. Millen's been canned. Roy's been traded. Kitna's on IR. Everything's been done. Everything's been talked about. It's finished. Boy, is this boring.
Sure we can spend time talking about Culpepper, but is that even a conversation worth having? I have to admit, I see the logic in the Lions' interest here. The free agent list for a veteran quarterback next year is pathetic (unless a trade option comes available). So maybe shoring up Culpepper as a veteran back-up or even interim starter isn't such a bad idea. As long as the mindset is for next year, because it's a rebuilder anyway.
Other than the Culpepper snippet, this thing is a bona-fide snoozefest. Win a game, lose a game... at this point no one cares. Maybe I feel this way because I was forced to watch a grainy feed of the Lions-Redskins game on the internet this weekend (even though I live almost two hours from Detroit - ripoff). I think the blackouts ultimately serve a purpose as a necessary evil in righting this ship, but it still stinks to miss a game. Maybe I'm just cranky and worn out over this whole mess of a season, but I just can't find much of a reason to rant this week. My gut tells me that everyone else is feeling the same way. It's a shame, too. I love reading the fanposts and hearing all of the different opinions and viewpoints out there. A lot of the time, it makes for better reading than the stuff regurgitated by the beat writers.
So on the behalf of all worn-out Lions fans out there, I'll try to summon the hutzpah to form a few talking points for everyone this week. Hopefully, it will spark a little debate in everyone to start talking and posting on here again.
- Talking Point #1: Let's talk first overall pick. Right now, I see only three options for the Lions. The only positions worthy of that pick for us are LT, DE and QB. The three players that rank that high right now are QB Matthew Stafford (Jr, Georgia), T Michael Oher (Sr, Ole MIss) and T Andre Smith (Jr, Alabama). And it's possible that neither Smith nor Stafford will come out early. It's nice to speculate, but once the season is over, the annual pre-draft shuffle of players begins and who knows where these guys ultimately get ranked. I've got two thoughts here. 1) The Lions need to upgrade Backus, but with his current contract status, cutting him is dicey at best. If we took Oher, Backus could move to RT and Cherilus could move inside to RG. That would only leave Mulitalo to be replaced. 2) This is a quarterbacks league and my gosh it would be nice to have a great quarterback to hang this franchise's hat on. I'm not saying Stafford is the one or that Stanton is not the one, but you don't get the first overall option very often.
- Talking Point #2: Obviously, this one will change by the time the offseason gets here, but looking at the current 2009 Free Agent list, who should the Lions go after? I could go on forever here, but I'll give you my top three and a sleeper. 1) Julius Peppers, DE CAR - Okay some team, maybe even Carolina will offer him ridiculous money. I think the Lions should be that team. No, he's not as good as the '06 version, but he's better than any player the Lions can draft. 2) Karlos Dansby, LB ARZ - It'll be interesting to see if he's allowed to leave Arizona or if he even wants to resign there. He'll get top dollar on the market, though. He's young, fast and his numbers have gotten better each year. 3) Nnamdi Asomugha, CB OAK - Another player that will get a big payday. Like Woodson, Al Davis loves his young corners, but hates paying the premium it takes to keep them through the second contract. They won't franchise him again. Another young, solid cover corner that will help some team. Sleeper: Dawan Landry, S BAL - I doubt he'll get out of Baltimore as a Restricted FA, but the Lions could use the extra third rounder on him if he's tendered correctly. He's an up-and-comer and would create a great safety tandem with Bullocks. Okay, there you have it... debate away on this one!
- Talking Point #3: I'll cop out on this one a bit and take a topic we've discussed at length - the next head coach of the Lions. I'll give you two options that you might not have thought about just to vary a little from the overused Bill Cowher debate. I love Cowher and hope that he changes his mind about coaching in '09, but it's still a very long shot. So here are my two guys... tell me what you think... 1) Josh McDaniels, OC NE - He's young and smart; in the mold of Eric Mangini. Pros: I think he could maximize the talents of a young QB and guys like C.Johnson. He's a clever playcaller, learning from Belichick. The younger players might love him. Cons: He's young - maybe too young. The veterans may not respect him and he may not have the credentials to get free agents to sign. 2) Dick LeBeau, DC PIT - I know, out of left field, right? Look, the guy bombed in Cincy with a horrible roster - the Rod Marinelli syndrome - good coach, bad team. The guy is a complete innovator when it comes to defense. I know, we are hiring a head coach, not a coordinator. But it's the only way we would get him and his system to Detroit. I love the 3-4 and I hope whichever coach we hire brings this system to town. This one is fair game for everyone - who are your suggestions?
I guess for not having a lot to say, I said an awful lot! Hopefully, I can get some dialogue going again, even if we have to talk about the offseason or next season. So keep firing away the fanposts, because people like me love to read them.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Pride of Detroit or its writers. FanPosts are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable fans.
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Great Rant.
Nice topics of discussion. For me, the most interesting thing you brought up was Free Agents for next year. I loved the idea of Asomugha or Dansby but the chances of snagging them is pretty low and we do have larger needs. Personally I would like us to take Jordan Gross from the Panthers. He’d be a huge improvement at Tackle and would help in the development of our atrocious line.
I almost added Gross to my list.
We’d have to move either Cherilus or Backus to guard. Gross isn’t dominant, but he’s much better than Backus. Problem is, Backus will be here next year. The Lion’s won’t take the cap hit by cutting him. They could trade him, though. I don’t think they’d get much and no team want to absorb a high-caliber contract for a low-caliber player.
drafting and free agency...
I think the lions need to use their 1st or 2nd overall pick to get Michael Oher on the OL, and then draft either Greg Hardy, Tyson Jackson, or Michael Johnson on the DL, depending on whos left and who looks the best come draft day. Keep in mind I’m going off of scouting reports as I don’t follow college football as much as many of you do. This way they immediately add immediate starters to the foundation of a winning team. I think the last thing the lions need is a qb, wr, or a rb, because those are not positions that rebuild a team, there positions that need a already good team in order to be successful. These picks would eliminate the need for players like Jered Devries and Chuck Darby on the DL and Stephen Peterman and Edwin Mulitalo, who on any other team, would be lucky to be 2nd or 3rd string, or on the team at all for that matter. Then, with free agency I think we need to acquire either Julius Peppers or Terrell Suggs to give the DL experienced playmakers. I also think that Mike Goss from the Chargers would make a nice addition to the Oline as well. As far as other offense positions go, I think you need to look at Desmond Clark from the bears so we have a talented TE, something we haven’t seen in years. I’ve noticed that most of the successful teams over the past couple years (or forever) seem to always have a legitimate TE, not someone who can just run a route and struggle making blocks, as it seems to be the only thing Michael Gaines is good at. I think in the 2nd and 3rd rounds we would try to get a starter for the secondary and address depth on the offensive line. It be nice to see us pick up Nnamdi Asomugha or Brian Dawkins in free agency. The final thing to address is the LB position, and we should look at James Farrior from Pittsburg. Possibly draft a LB, but I’m not sure there will be anyone worth drafting past the 1st half of the 2nd round, unless I’m mistaken, then someone please correct me. As a matter of fact, if I’ve got some facts wrong on any of the college players, feel free to correct me, because like I said, I am pretty much ignorant when it comes to the draft. If they aren’t a household name or I haven’t read a scouting report on them, then I’m probably clueless. Anyways, that was my 2 cents, or 50 bucks, however you wanna look at it. Let me know what you think. By the way, nice post drewslions.
Great comments.
In the draft, I like Michael Johnson a lot, too. Problem there is that when it’s all said and done, he’s going to probably be a top ten guy, but not a top two or three. Therefore, we won’t be able to get him with our second first rounder. That’s why they’ve got to spend for Peppers. He’s an immediate impact player. I agree that you build through the draft, but you have to supplement here and there in free agency – and it’s quality, not quantity.
Also, I almost added Mike Goff to my list. He’s a solid player and I’m sure San Diego will let him go. Problem is, he’ll be 33 next year and I think the Lions need to go with younger guys. It’s always good to bring a few vets though. He could take over the LG for Mulitalo who is way past his prime.
I would definitely go for Peppers. Also a replacement for Backus in the draft would be nice—if they drafted Oher and kept Backus, could they maybe put Backus second on the depth chart?
I’ve also thought about the QB situation, and I actually think Culpepper might not be a bad add. I’m still a fan of picking up Kyle Boller in the offseason though.
As for head coaches, I’ll throw Marty Schottenheimer’s name into the mix.
Marty's a great choice, too.
I’ve always liked Schottenheimer. He’s a bit hokey and can get a little conservative offensively, but a hell of a coach. I’ll worry about the playoff loss thing after he gets the Lions to the playoffs. That’s not a bad problem to have!
Schottenhiemer
I’ll take consistently getting to the playoffs and not winning a superbowl over consistently losing 10-14 games a season.
its alright sean
i know exactly what you mean…
there’s nothing to talk about with the Lions anymore!
at least at this point
by youtalkintome7 on Oct 30, 2008 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
i think...
you’re confused, sean didn’t post this, drewslions did.
by lions_sucker on Oct 30, 2008 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions
oh
sorry bout that…either way…go lions?
by youtalkintome7 on Oct 31, 2008 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Lions are a half-game ahead
Here’s something else to talk about:
Technically the Lions (0-7) are a half game ahead of the Bengals (0-8). We should talk about what a good job Marinelli is doing to keep the Lions out of the cellar. ;-)
(Things will even up after the Bengal’s bye week.)
I noticed you noticing Dawan Landry, and even caught a Kyle Boller post
On Landry – The Ravens will at least tender Landry, but it may only be a second round tender, as we carry five safeties on the roster right now. Since he was drafted in the fifth round, I don’t believe there is any 3rd round tender. It would be either the 2nd or 5th round tender, and there is no way the Ravens don’t put a 2nd round tender on a 3 year starter. Would you really want to give up a high second rounder for him? You could try trading for him, like give us a second and we give you Landry and a fourth. All, I’m saying, is that he is not leaving for free. Note, we all expect that he’ll recover from the spinal concussion injury, but he’s not playing right now.
Boller is free, you can have him, and I hope he does well for somebody somewhere.
If you want the 3-4 defense, Ravens DC Rex Ryan would be a more natural choice for head coach than Dick LeBeau. Rex Ryan is younger, and desperately wants to be a head coach. His players love him, and you’d probably get several Ravens defenders to bolster your roster (although obviously the older and less good ones).
If i’m the Lions, after I’m done hiring a general manager, I immediately try to acquire as many draft picks as possible, even the late round ones. You’ve already started that with Roy Williams, but I’d continue it with just about anyone you can come up with for trade bait and trading down with draft picks.
Thanks for the heads up...
…on the third round tender. I didn’t know that. Actually, I think they’ll probably give him the highest 1st & 3rd tender. And I agree that it will be tough to get him. This was more of a wishlist than anything. We all know how things can change in the offseason.
Two more quick points… First on Boller. This seems to be a common opinion. I’m not sure why you would want him. I’ve seen him play and I’ve got to disagree quite a bit on this one. He’s got the look of a guy who will never be either consistent or accurate enough to be a successful starter. He’s young, but still got bust written all over him. Second, your comment on Rex Ryan. He’s the better, more tempered of the two Ryans, but I’d still take LeBeau over Ryan. More experience, more innovative and remember, he was the corner opposite Lem Barney and Night Train during the golden era of Lions football. He’d love to come here a resurrect this franchise. I think he could do it too. Anyway, great comments – well thought out.
maybe on the LeBeau business
but he’s also 71 years old. That’s a pretty old spot to take a head coaching gig, especially when his last one is considered to be a failure.
Rex Ryan is more realistically going to be interested in the job, and a sure bet to bring in the 3-4.
Point taken
I agree that Ryan is definately worth a look. But I won’t concede that LeBeau would be a bad choice. Did you see the Monday Night game of the Steelers at the Redskins. LeBeau’s game plan was genius – pure and simple. He makes up so much for the lack of offense the Steelers sometimes have. That defense is the reason for that team’s consistency. He’d never leave PIT for anything less than a head coaching stint. And for his tenure with the Bengals…. Bill Walsh couldn’t have won there. Mike Brown & Matt Millen are equals in judging talent. He had nothing to work with.
There are lots of good options out there as far as coaches go. LeBeau & Ryan are both good ones. It’s a draw… how about that?
haha, I have an incredible amount of respect for LeBeau and what he’s done. I don’t want that to be overlooked. I, personally, as a Ravens fan, would love it if LeBeau became a head coach somewhere. Absolutely love it. You’re right about the Bengals, they are terrible.
That being said, I think an older coach only really makes sense for a team that wants to win now. I realize the Dolphins and the Falcons magically rebuilt themselves over-night after getting rid of the previous management. But that is pretty much the exception, not the rule.
The Lions have major issues at every position, even WR, where Shaun McDonald is a free agent that may want to test the market. The roster is going to need a total overhaul. What you don’t want is to work on rebuilding the team and then have to find a head coach because the current head coach that helped rebuild the team is ready to retire. There are tons of stellar young defensive coaching candidates (Rex Ryan, Jim Schwartz, Spagnuolo are a few of them). Bobby April, the incredible ST coordinator for the Buffalo Bills might be worth a look too. As Harbaugh for the Ravens has been seen as a very successful hire, more teams are going to look at ST coordinators as potential Head Coaches. You want the Lions HC to be a success for sure, but once he is a success, you want him to be around for 15 years.
Okay, you've got me.
LeBeau’s probably not going to coach too much longer. And it would make sense to hire someone that has the capacity for long-term tenure. That’s why I covered both ends of the spectrum here. My other option was McDaniels, who is in his 30’s. So how’s that for a youth movement!
I agree that there are lots of good choices out there. I just hope we finally put our eggs in the right basket.
So you’re a Raven’s fan, huh??? Do you like the Lions as well? Tell you what, I’d be much happier as a Raven’s fan for the foreseeable future than a Lions fan. The Ravens are infusing a good young core into that veteran team and they should be good for years to come. Problem for me is that I can’t not be a Lions fan… it’s a horrible condition… no cure that I know of. Just misery… and blogging!
McDaniels is an extremely interesting choice. Last year I was shaky on him as a hot-shot coordinator who had put together an incredible offense with more offensive talent than any other two teams put together (See Billick, Brian). However, what he’s done with Matt Cassel is quite incredible. I think one of the most important elements in an offensive coach is the ability to intelligently develop QBs. It seems like McDaniels has it.
I think the more important choice for Detroit, however, is General Manager. Talent comes first. I mean, I don’t even think Marinelli isn’t an awful coach.
One of my closest friends is a Lions fan, so I almost always root for them along with the Eagles and Bills (weird choice of teams, I know). I’m also fascinated in the building/rebuilding draft and offseason process. A team like the Lions is extremely interesting because they are going to make so many changes.
I do think I’m happier as a Ravens fan, however.
I absolutely agree that...
…GM is the most important thing for this team right now. No question about it. As far as coaches, I was in Rod’s corner until this season. It’s got to be tough to go through a season like this, but the dude has gone off his rocker a little bit. Some of his personnel calls have been more than questionable. I think it’s time for a clean sweep.
I too love the rebuilding process (that’s why I’m a huge Madden fan also), but Detroit is a team stuck in perpetual rebuild-mode. That get’s a little frustrating. Hopefully, they can get it right this time and in 2011 the Super Bowl will be Detroit and Baltimore!
That would put a huge smile on my face
I’ve actually tried to play the NFL Head coach series of games. Terrible games, but I love draft day.
I picked the Lions for the 2006 version and drafted Jay Cutler, Kameiron Wimbley, and Joseph Addai in the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd rounds. I’m not kidding. It was awesome.
Of course, Wimbley turned out to be a bust, but I’m sure the Lions wouldn’t have minded Cutler and Addai.
First off
Hire floyd reese….or someone of that caliber that knows a thing or two about football and how to build a competitor. Next FIRE Rod Marinelli and all of the coaching staff and boot as many players off that poor team. Then trade one of the first rounders to the Browns for Derrick Anderson. Use the first overall pick for the most important position in football and that is LT…..or trade the top pick and move a couple slots down and pick up a DE and a few more draft picks to start building an O-line. screw getting any free agents of high claiber because it would require an enormous amount of funds for them to even consider coming here (remember edjerin james to arizona?)
First rounder for Anderson!!!
Holy smokes, svsuLION! Have you seen him play? He just got benched and you want to pony up one of our first rounders for him? Geez. I agree that you need to build this team through the draft, but with the horrible roster that we currently have, we have to supplement a little in free agency. Are you telling be you wouldn’t get excited about Peppers in honolulu blue? C’mon. They couldn’t draft anyone even remotely close to him. They need to at least pick up one or two starters in free agency in the offseason to even have a chance to compete next year.
FIRST ROUNDER FOR ANDERSON!!!!!!!!!!
the guy is worth it. I am not absolving him for his poor performance so far this season…but his upside and his proven PRO BOWL ability to play and make a poor 2007 browns team win 10 games is definitely worth the pick. I would love to see Julius Peppers here but we would have to sign him to a record deal and give him our left testicles just for him to even think about this dump of a situation. Do you really think these guys could compete next year?!?! those two free agent starters you are thinking of would have to be players like Ray Lewis and Albert Haynesworth to even consider it. i do think Michael Johnson out of Georgia Tech could be a younger and better julius peppers but i do now know at what cost it would take if he was a top 3 pick. we all know the lions are gonna be drafting top 3 this year and his cap hit would be tremendous given the ridiculous salaries the nfl gives to rookies. i would much rather see them take a franchise LT like they should have with Joe Thomas….and it looks like there will be some good top 5 LT’s in this draft. It is time to start building the lines through the draft and free agency should not be the focus.
If i may add how sweet would it be to grab michale oher out of Ole Miss or the guy out of Arkansas and then nab up the guard/tackle at Oklahoma. we could package our 2nd and a 3rd to get in the first round and grab that all-world center out of cal. Move gosder to RG…man i need to stop I’m gettin light headed…this makes way too much sense……
apologize
I apologize for my rant justa minute ago…..I am getting way too ahead with all of this…we all know they are gonna draft a position player with those two beautiful oppurtunities in the first round
Don't apologize!
Those are great comments and I love a good debate… that’s why I post here. Look, with the looming uncapped season due to the CBA mess and the salary cap outlook over the next two years, there is no reason that the Lions can’t spend a little dough. In fact, they should. With most of the dead money gone next year for Mike Williams, Charles Rogers et. al., they should be able to pick up a few KEY free agents to help build this team back up. Remember, if we gave Peppers a ridiculous deal, it’s with the assumption that he’s here for a while. So it’s not like franchising a guy. It’s a long term investment.
I agree with you on taking a tackle in the top of the first. The only problem there is that you can’t get rid of Backus with his current contract. You’d have to shuffle (like you stated above) or pay him to ride the bench (which the frugal Lions won’t do). Also, the Lions think Backus is a good starter, so I don’t realistically see them looking to supplant him… at least not next year. They look to fill holes elsewhere.
Anyway, don’t worry about offending me with your posts. As long as they are well thought out opinions and not vulgar, I love a good debate!
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