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Quarterbacks: Front & (Under) Center

I can’t help but speculate at this time of year what the next season’s roster will look like.  Obviously, the quarterback position is on my mind.  Isn’t it always?  You guys probably think I’m a little obsessive about that position, and maybe I am, but it’s the spot that drives the team both offensively and defensively.  Its importance cannot be underestimated.  No, I’m not here to battle the draftniks again for the rights to the first overall pick.  In fact, I think that the boards and perhaps the Lions will start to drift away from Stafford and Sanchez as viable number one options.  I’m not a scout, so my information comes from the same place yours does and those sources are not as high on either of these guys like they were a few weeks ago.  It’ll all change a thousand times before late April, so this chatter is nothing more than speculation… like all media talk about the draft.

 

But if it’s not Stafford or Sanchez, then who?   Someone has to be under center come September.  There are only four truly viable options to get a quarterback.  Draft one, sign one, trade for one, or use one you already have.  Let’s look at each of these in a little detail and I’ll give my opinion on what percent chance each of these scenarios has of actually happening.

 

Draft:

In the Lion’s immediate situation, I disagree wholeheartedly with taking a quarterback lower than the first round.  If we are going that route, just start Stanton.  Don’t waste another pick on a guy that’s purely potential or project.  If that type of player exists on your roster, you don’t pick him again (i.e. Stanton & Henson).  If you draft a guy in the first round, it sends the clear signal that he is either the starter or the heir apparent… no controversy.  At some point, he’ll get every opportunity to play.  The lower round guys rarely get that opportunity.  The staff never truly believes in him.  His shot is in pre-season and then he always has to beat out the journeyman stop-gap that we’ve signed.  It just doesn’t seem to work well.  If it’s not at the top, drafting is not a good option this year.

Percent chance our starter will come from the draft:  20%

 

Free Agency:

Well, the list is pretty thin.  Unless some unexpected cuts happen, the probability of finding a quality starter in Free Agency is bleak.  I think that Collins and Warner are back with their respective teams in 2009 and even so, why sign a guy for one season unless you have a young guy waiting in the wings.  We already have Kitna and Culpepper on the roster.  That leaves Matt Cassell, who will likely be franchised, or someone like J.P. Losman or Rex Grossman.  No, they don’t make me feel warm and fuzzy about the starting position either.  Like I said, unless some team makes a relatively dramatic move, quarterback free agency will look like a bare cupboard come March.

Percent chance our starter will come from free agency:  5%

 

Trade:

In order to trade for someone, there must be a team out there with two quality quarterbacks.  Quality, of course, is a matter of one’s opinion.  I still hear people talking about trading for Derek Anderson.  Why?  The guy had weapons around him this year and proved that he was a one-hit wonder or an inconsistent player at best.  Why give a pick for him?  Keep in mind, that to give up a pick the guy has to be capable of starting and still have upside.  Take guys like Todd Collins or Brad Johnson off the table right now.  Hopefully, that is not who we are looking for.  Also, take all of the heir apparents off the table as well.  Guys like Matt Leinart, Vince Young, etc.  Their teams still expect a contribution from them and either won’t part with them or if they do, it will come at a very steep price.  There are only a few guys in mind that MIGHT be good trade options if the trade comes cheap enough.  My short list would include… Kyle Orton, Alex Smith, Seneca Wallace, Kellen Clemens, Jim Sorgi, and Sage Rosenfels.  These are guys that have shown a little potential and are still young enough to have a few good years left.  I added Sorgi because learning behind Manning has to count for something.  Anyway, you are probably about as impressed with this list as I am. Unless one of these guys comes dirt cheap and all other options fail, I doubt that trading will be the ticket.

 Percent chance our starter will come via trade:  1%

 

Already Here:

The Lions had five different quarterbacks take snaps this year and it’s appalling that we still don’t know if we have a starter in our midst.  The options are Orlovsky, Stanton, Culpepper, Henson and Kitna.  Let’s be real and take Henson off the list.  He’s a project, nothing more.  Having him and Stanton should keep the Lions from taking a late round project.  Stanton is the real wild card here.  I have no idea what Mayhew thinks of him.  Are they secretly thinking he can start or like Martz, Coletto and Marinelli, do they feel he’s a not-so-ready for primetime player?  Mayhew and Schwartz’s plans for Stanton will directly impact all personnel moves.  Orlovsky is the biggest bust/boom prospect.  He’s a risk because you have to put yet another financial investment in him… even though he is still relatively unproven.  In his starts, he was average at best (on an average offense) and never showed flashes of greatness.  I’m afraid they want him as a one-year starter and have to pay a 2 to 3 year price for him.  In the end, though, I think he’ll disappoint.  Culpepper, in my humble opinion, is at the end of a good career and can’t help the Lions anymore.  He’s too old to have potential and too expensive to sign short term.  Kitna is the real intrigue for me here.  Not necessarily in a good way.  Probably still the most capable quarterback on the roster for a one-year option.  The true questions about Kitna are if he can 1) overcome the cold shoulder he received from the Lions and put his heart back into the game and this city, 2) be content with whatever offensive approach the Lions decide to take and 3) be okay with being the back-up if need be. 

Percent chance our starter will come from the current roster:  74%

 

 

All of that said… my approach would be to first cut Culpepper.  Regardless of anything else that happens, Culpepper cannot help this team any more than Kitna and Kitna is cheaper.  Also, regardless of the draft, I would NOT resign Orlovsky.  With limited options, it will be tempting, but they should go another route.  If all else fails… draft options fall through, no quality free agents or trade options… they should keep Kitna, Stanton and Henson on the roster.  Let Kitna and Stanton battle for the number one spot and Henson remains a pet project.  If Kitna wins out, start him and prepare to take a quarterback in the 2010 draft.  If Stanton wins, Kitna is your quality, veteran quarterback and Stanton will get his chance to show that he is your quarterback of the future.  If he turns out to be a stud, it saves you a first round pick next year as well.  If, of course, Stafford grades out at number one, you still keep Stanton and Kitna.  Kitna becomes your back-up and Stanton takes Henson’s spot as the project.

 

Okay, lots of opinions to digest.  Remember, this isn’t a discussion about wanting to draft a quarterback or not… we’ve beat that one to death, I think.  I want to hear your comments on trade options or free agent options that I missed and what to do with the guys on the roster.  Swing away!

 

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Pride of Detroit's main writer, Sean, or the site in general. FanPosts are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable fans.

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I agree with VanOchten

take Texas Tech’s Graham Harrell in the 3rd round if they really want to draft a QB (I still like Purdue’s Curtis Painter in rounds 5-7 as a sleeper). Definitely cut Culpepper. He was a mistake last year. Stanton should have been starting with Kitna and Orlovsky down or benched. Not sure if I like the big three for next year either. Tebow, Bradford or McCoy. Not sure they’ll rate out any higher than Stafford this year. I would rather have Orapko, Smith, Oher or Maualuga with the 1st pick.

BTW, DL. Congrats on the "promotion’. Keep up the great writing.

I has a blog

"A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five." ~Groucho Marx

by Jettero2112 on Jan 20, 2009 5:45 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I like the Harrel idea

and then get Mike Leach as offensive coordinator!! im gonna keep saying this till it happens!

"Sometimes Joe (morgan) doesn't like facts to get in the way of his opinions."- billy beane
"That was a great pick...if this was 2002" Me, to guy who selected Barry Zito in a fantasy draft
www.27ClubPeak.blogspot.com

by harendaman365 on Jan 21, 2009 12:09 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

What about Cassell?

I know you said trading for a QB is slim, but what happens if Brady’s knee checks out and the Patriots don’t need Cassell? They won’t want to eat the $36 Million or so in salary of having two franchise QB’s on the roster.

I would be willing to part with the #1 overall pick for Cassell. It is a better option than drafting an unproven QB at #1. I don’t think New England would want it unless they could trade it, but it is worth it. Or package #20 from Dallas and a 2nd rounder for him.

That said, I don’t mind the idea of letting Stanton and Kitna battle it out and see who rises to the top. In that case I am rooting for Stanton, but I am not hopeful.

The Lions, at this point, need to use the resources they have at thier immediate disposal, which, unfortunately, is a glut of washed up and unproven QB’s. They need to be sure that they are not relaesing a future Kurt Warner/Tony Romo in Stanton or Kerry Collins in Kitna. Exhaust all possibilities before you make a decision or rule anyone out.

I am willing to be patient while the Lions take time to find a franchise QB, it’s only been decades since we’ve had one. Take a season, git ti right and don’t rush it. Evaluate and prioritize.

by TonyDC on Jan 20, 2009 6:42 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

cassell would be nice

but my guess is that the Pats will wait a few weeks into the season before thinking about shopping him. Brady is recovering from a serious injury with complications, so they’ll prob be cautious. Even if he’s healthy they’ll wait a little bit to make sure.

If all else fails, maybe its an option…but i think the cost is way too high. If we try to franchise him before he signs the franchise tender, then we owe the Pats two 1st round draft picks. The other alternative is trying to work out a trade after he signs the franchise tender, but my guess is that the asking price may be too high considering his stock is high right now.

by cridg1zt on Jan 20, 2009 9:14 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

the Pats could (will) tag him as leverage and then ask for whatever they want, potentially creating a bidding war.

I do agree though, that the Pat’s won’t pull the trigger on a trade until they full knnow if Brady’s knee is healed and he is back to true form.

by TonyDC on Jan 20, 2009 9:24 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Cassell took a 16-0 team to 11-5

I’m not saying he’s a bad QB, but playing in arguably the best-coached, best managed, most talented franchise in the NFL will make any QB look better than he is.

Cassell didn’t elevate his team. He just managed the game and played as well as the team around him. So did Dan Orlovsky.

The ONLY good thing we have here that Cassell had in NE is an elite #1 WR. Imagine the shell-shock of going from…
New England (dynasty, perennial contender) to Detroit (travesty, perennial rebuilder)
Proven coach to Rookie coach
Matt Light (2x Pro-Bowler) to Jeff Backus (turnstile LT)
Wes Welker (2x All-Pro) to Mike Furrey (recovering from a severe concussion)
Ben Watson (good TE) to (who’s our TE?)
Elite defense to Detroit’s defense

I wouldn’t mind Matt Cassell, but I don’t think he’s worth what it would take to get him.

by n4ry4 on Jan 21, 2009 10:32 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Cassell will cost...

us TWO first round picks if he is franchised. From “the sources” out there… it seems that it is quite likely that New England will tag him. If they don’t, he’s simply a free agent. No trade or picks required. He is not good enough for two first round picks… not even close. But as a free agent… well, that changes everything. Go get him. No doubt.

Again, chances are very slim that the Patriots just let him walk away. He’s too valuable and they have the cap room to keep him around for another year and no one else to use the franchise tag on. But two first round picks are not an option. We want MORE picks, not less.

by DrewsLions on Jan 21, 2009 3:53 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Lets not forget Byron Leftwich

I agree that Culpepper and Orlovsky should be shown the door, but lets not forget that a very underrated quarterback in Leftwich will be available in the offseason.

The only problem with Leftwich is that he’s probably going to be the hottest commodity in free agency, so the price may be higher than he’s worth. Either way, the Lions should at least consider that option.

by dr_dreidel on Jan 20, 2009 6:45 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Not sure if Leftwich is...

any better than Kitna. I absolutely HATE his big wind-up of an arm motion. Defenses can see it coming for miles. He can’t pump fake because it would take half the quarter. If we didn’t already have a short-term option under contract, he might be worth a one year contract. My guess is Pittsburgh will not resign Batch and sign Leftwich to a new two or three year deal as Roethlisberger’s back-up.

by DrewsLions on Jan 21, 2009 3:57 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

orlovsky v. stanton

i second the congrats to DL. You’ve put together some well thought out posts that make a huge contribution to this site.

i’m not ready to give up on Dan O, thats if we can get him back at a fair price, so I guess thats the major issue. I think he gave the Lions the best chance to win this season. He’s proven he’s got the arm to get CJ the long ball, battled back after a tough injury, and even showed some leadership skills when he was under center. I’d really like to see him play behind a better built line.

I feel bad that Stanton hasn’t really been given a shot, but the fact that the people who saw him on a daily basis (Martz, Colleto, Marinelli) didn’t trust him or thought he would “embarrass” himself is alarming. They brought a guy in off the street instead of giving him a shot. I’d also be concerned that Stanton is more of a mobility QB, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing, but how will that effect getting CJ the deep shot? I wouldnt cut the guy, but it also wouldnt prevent me from looking for talent at QB deep in the draft.

Culpepper got thrown to the wolves and failed, so see you later. Henson can stay on the practice squad if there is room. In the end, I’d take Dan Orlovsky as the starter going into next season, Stanton fighting for the 1st but second in the depth chart, and keep Kitna as the vet.

Hopefully find some talent late in the draft. That kid from K State looks like a beast, but I’ll leave that up to our hardworking GM Mayhew and our scouting experienced head coach.

Alright, so give me your shots for backing the Big East QB.

by cridg1zt on Jan 20, 2009 7:33 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Very interesting

I agree wholeheartedly that if we don’t take a quarterback with one of our first two picks, then we should not spend a middle round pick taking another potential guy. However, I would not be opposed on using a 5th or 6th round pick to take a project quarterback like Curtis Painter, Willie Tuitama, or Rudy Carpenter. Also, I would not be against picking Pat White with a fourth round pick because if everything went awry, he could play quarterback halfway decently, and besides that, he is being viewed as a WR, which we have a huge need for. As for free agent quarterbacks, the pickins are slim. Matt Cassel doesn’t seem like he is worth what it would cost to trade for him. I think without Josh McDaniels and the Patriots O-Line, he is a mediocre starter at best. The smartest course of action is to build our defense and O-Line. Once we start seeing improvement in those areas, then we can spend money on a premier quarterback, be it a veteran or a rookie.

Check out motownballin.blogspot.com

by n1ck34 on Jan 20, 2009 7:51 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I don't think

any qb is gonna shine here in Detroit without rebuilding/adding some talent to the o line. I’m sick of Backus, he hasnt really proved me anything, and I don’t think he is what he was cracked up to be. But that’s me. Cherilus could be good if he would stop committing so many damn penalties. Then you draft someone like Andre Smith and sign a decent free agent, and were back in business. Then anyone of these three guys ( dano, kitna, stanton) have a good shot at starting.

by Megatron on Jan 20, 2009 9:03 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

agree

build the line, establish the running game. i think an effective running game would help out either of the three mentioned before.

by cridg1zt on Jan 20, 2009 9:23 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Draft...

Andre Smith/Michael Oher as a LT.
Put Backus at RT
Put Cherilus at OG- his natural position.

by TonyDC on Jan 20, 2009 9:29 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Cherilus is a natural RT, not a G

Cherilus is a natural Right Tackle. He even played Left Tackle his senior year at BC. He matches up well against Left Defensive Ends (the “power-end”). His height, long arms, and big frame help him pass-block; he’s not necessarily the thick, stout, pure-mauler that you want your OG to be.

Cherilus could probably play Guard okay if he had to, but he’s at his best at RT. And he’s a first-round pick earning first-round money. You don’t spend that on a Guard unless he’s Hutch.

I wouldn’t move our promising young first-rounder to a different spot just to “find somewhere to put Backus”.

Backus is not strong enough to play Right Tackle. He can’t run-block big guys. And he’s too expensive for the position too.

If Backus can’t play Left Tackle (and it looks like at this point in has career, he can’t), he’s not worth his contract. Cut him.

by n4ry4 on Jan 21, 2009 10:15 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yep...

that’s starting to look more and more like the plan… which is a good one. I don’t think we can expect a big jump in our offensive ranking until we get a better quarterback, but no doubt an improved line or defense will help things immensely.

by DrewsLions on Jan 21, 2009 4:00 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Stafford or Sanchez

Former Titans GM Floyd Reese used to say “You never pass up a chance at a franchise QB.” I think by the end of the combine and pro day workouts, one of these guys will rise to the top and be worthy of the first overall pick. Don’t forget the Lions have 5 picks in the first 3 rounds. I would go QB #1 overall and there is a good chance there will be a premiere left tackle available at #20 (there are about 5 quality left tackles in this draft). Then spend the second round pick and both 3rd round picks on defense. Also don’t forget what Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco did this year.

by TitanRob on Jan 20, 2009 10:37 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I hope you're right, TitanRob!

My ultimate hope is that Stafford grades out as one of the best picks in the draft and the “new” Lions get started there. I know many don’t share that opinion, but that’s okay. It’ll be tough for the Lions to have a bad pick when they have so many needs. This draft will ultimately be judged by whether or not it was a good individual pick, not a good positional pick. They have lots of options, but yes, I hope that Stafford is the real deal.

Are you a Titans fan, TitanRob? If so, what do you think about Schwartzy? I hear he’s got a bit of a bad rep in Nashville (I have in-laws there). They say his schemes are too passive. What do you think?

by DrewsLions on Jan 21, 2009 4:04 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Stanton and Kitna!!

Even though they will probably draft Stafford I like the idea of signing Leftwich or letting Stanton and Kitna battle it out. The short time that Stanton has been in games he has shown some promise. If Kitna gets along with the coaches he could be solid until Stanton gets better.

by hate2lovelions on Jan 21, 2009 8:44 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Disagree...What Qb in the Draft

I don’t know how many of you guys watch college football, but let me say there is no real first round qb in this draft. Stafford is a long work in progress in my opinion he is another Brody Croyle and lets face it that guy is never really going to be a starter. The next guy would be Sanchez, so lets say that most likely he also would be a pet project to become a starter.

Our biggest need is not a QB! We currently have 5 guys on the roster and by the time Feb hits it will be down to three. I don’t know which one they will keep between Kitna and Culpepper, but I would be fine with releasing both those guys.

Cassell isn’t a good option because lets be honest….The man step into a ferri and all the coaches had to do was tweak the offense to fit his style. I think Joey harrington could look awesome in that offense….Cassell isn’t worth the picks we would have to give to get him.

Lets just pray Stanton can pull it out! Lets stop worrying about Qbs and worry about our defense. THAT IS THE REAL REASON THIS TEAM WENT 0-16! We have two players worth keeping on that Defense! Avril and Sims can be keep but everyone else SPECIALLY Bodden and Redding need to go.

by Fuzzdog20 on Jan 21, 2009 9:46 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Well, not sure we have to...

quit worrying about the quarterback… i.e. the most important position on the team. But no doubt that the defense needs extra attention this April. Also, I’m positive that Harrington couldn’t have won 11 games in New England. Remember, they had a ton of offensive injuries on the line and Maroney was out most of the year. The kid Cassel has some skill. I wouldn’t mind taking a shot on him. Just keep a veteran in the bullpen just to be sure. Just don’t give him a Mitchell-like contract.

by DrewsLions on Jan 21, 2009 4:08 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Top QB's picks are as much as a gamble as a top WR.

I don’t care how the old coaching staff evaluated Drew Stanton in practice because they turned out to be wrong enough to manage zero wins. Bottom line is Stanton was a 2nd round pick that wasn’t a waste like the others yet. He ran a top 10 offense in college. Even if he practices like garbage which I doubt you still have to play him based on potential. Practice does not require or demand the focus and concentration a real game has so the only way to evaluate him would be play him. Orlovsky got his shot in 08 and proved he was a 5th rounder QB. I think that many in Detroit and all of Michigan for that matter would rather see our 2nd round homegrown QB get his first shot and fail than see these other QB’s that have failed before get the shot and be failures again. Do not draft a QB #1 in the first round because Alex Smith, Matt Lienart, Vince Young, and Chris Sims. There is not a Peyton Manning or Philip Rivers in this draft. Do not trade the valuable picks for another QB. Even bad QB’s will win as long as the rest of the team is good, Scott Majakowski the 6’6’ side arm wonder proved that.

by MonteCarlo7888 on Jan 21, 2009 2:34 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Dan O

I’m gonna try to keep backing up the man. So I’m on board with an O linemen with the first then defense the rest of the way, maybe a QB late..but I think Dan O played better than a 5th rounder.

Just from a stats perspective (which I know can be deceiving), the Lions scored 17 or more points in 5 of the 8 games he played in essentially his first year seeing significant action. I think he did enough to win ball games and gave away less games than the usual kitna breakdown, but our defense bombed just about every week.

by cridg1zt on Jan 21, 2009 3:56 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with your Stanton assessment

I just wish that we’d found out a little more about him this year. That was one of Marinelli’s biggest mistakes. Given that… you have to hedge your bet with another QB on the roster. I’d like nothing more than to see Stanton succeed, but for God’s sake… have a plan B and a plan C.

by DrewsLions on Jan 21, 2009 4:12 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Out with the old in with the new

i’m going to make it short and sweet its late and i’m too tired to go on and on=== Kitna and Culpepper out. Give Dan O. a fighting chance with Stanton from the start of spring training. i think Dan O. never had the chance to learn properly at “game speed” he was the back up to a starting QB that hardly ever missed a game so i’m sure he knew he wasn’t fighting for a starting position he was fighting for the back up spot in the past. I think he can fine tune is skills and be much more productive if he were battling for the top position i think he, like Culpepper, were just unprepared and thrown into the “lions den”.
i will also say that we should NOT take a QB in the first round O-line and Defense should be our main concern if we can pick up a big QB with a strong arm then maybe, maybe pick him up otherwise we should wait till next year and see how this plays out.

by chainsaw on Jan 22, 2009 12:23 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

I don't think so yet!

I really believe that we have what it takes to win some ball games next year. I’m really not too familiar with Stanton, I say give him a chance in camp and preseason. In my eyes, Kitna has proven himself WHEN he has protection. True enough he is old. Culpepper possibly could do well if he learned the system. Then again, he is old too. I doubt we get anyone worth taking in free agency. I like the Graham Harrell idea as a 3rd rounder. It is not the players job to teach young quarterbacks. It is the quarterbacks coach and the offensive coordinators’ job to teach. But if we want to win right now, don’t draft a QB. Stick with what we have. Get them some protection. I’m so sick of seeing Kitna being sacked on commercials. It really hurts my damn feelings. I am a very passionate Lions fan. I have been a fan for 18 years. My Lions on Madden and Head Coach make the playoffs within 2 years of simulating. Maybe I should be GM. LOL

by Quez81 on Jan 22, 2009 1:30 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Schwartz's schemes

I was asked the question about Schwartz taking heat in Nashville. The truth is when he first took over, the Titans had been used to Gregg Williams very aggressive, blitzing style. Then Scwartz came in (and to be fair to Jim, the Titans did lose a number of good defensive players to salary cap issues) and ran more of a passive style. His first couple of years he took a lot of heat for the passive style, but we grew accustomed to it. But that only lasted a couple of years. The past several years he has been very respected and EVERYBODY (players, coaches, media and fans) all wish the best for Jim and are rooting for him.

by TitanRob on Jan 22, 2009 8:31 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Be realistic

The HC has done a great job bringing a good coaching system here, If you listen to his comments he say’s games are won at both ends of the line. He knows drafting a QB will take to long to groom. “Please don’t bring up Matty ice name please”. He also knows keeping culpepper will send mixed messages to what he whats to do. 1st he let’s culpepper go 2.5 million to much 2nd they resign Danny O to a short contract but that gives a couple million in a signing bonus to make it worth his while 3rd they post a open battle in training camp between stanton and Danny O, my feeling is Danny O wins it and becomes a good game manager. Let me know

by msivits on Jan 23, 2009 4:54 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

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