Prisco's Take on Lions' QB Race
This story is probably not for those of you in Culpepper's corner, but an interesting read nonetheless.
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Comments
Stupid Debate?!? HELL NO!
I think the debate has been passionate and intelligent on both sides.
And besides, what else have we got to argue talk about?
by NorthLeft12 on Jun 30, 2009 1:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
"End the silly debate, and accept MY side of the debate"
The title of the article did seem kind of presumptuous, but it pretty well summed up the “start Stafford now” point of view.
I won’t be disappointed either way. I’ve flip-flopped my view of this personally, but ultimately I think the best quarterback, who gives us the best chance to win, should start that Sunday.
However, there are some ideas, stated or assumed, in this article that I really don’t accept as a foregone conclusion:
1. Starting a QB as a rookie is a better idea than waiting, as a general rule.
This is one of those areas where you can really get into a historical example/counterexample debate.
The author seems to accept positive examples of QB’s starting right away (e.g. Manning), while disregarding or “explaining away” negative examples of QB’s starting right away (e.g. Car, Couch, Harrington).
The facts are…
There are QB’s who started right away and became successful (Manning, Aikman).
There are QB’s who started right away and did not succeed (Carr, Couch).
There are QB’s who did not start or hardly played as rookies, and ultimately became successful (Favre, Brady).
There are QB’s who did not start or hardly played as rookies, and ultimately did not succeed in the following years (JP Lossman, Drew Stanton).
I don’t think there’s a one-size-fits-all rule for when a QB should start in order to maximize his long-term potential. Every player develops differently.
2. Stafford will be a better QB in 2010 and 2011 if he starts a lot in 2009.
If a rookie QB like Matt Ryan can step in and immediately be successful as a rookie, couldn’t a second-year QB (Stafford in 2010) step in year 2 and be all-the-more ready to start, if Culpepper happens to be the better option at QB in 2009?
3. Stafford should start right away because we’re in a “rebuilding year”. Getting Stafford experience is more important than winning games in 2010.
I recognize the reality that it is not likely we will be in the playoff hunt after last year’s disaster. But on the other hand, Miami went from 1-15 to 11-5, and that was just last year. Other teams have had quick turnarounds too. Is winning football games every Sunday so unimportant or unlikely to matter during a “rebuilding year” that we should play a rookie for his own experience, at the expense of a better chance to win, if the veteran happens to offer that?
I think winning always matters, no matter what conventional wisdom tells you you’re supposed to expect during any given season. I think winning games matters a lot more than gaining experience for a young QB. imo.
Now, I wouldn’t argue that Culpepper is definitely a better QB than Stafford and gives us the better chance to win in 2009. But I think it’s possible that Culpepper is a better QB than Stafford and gives us the better chance to win in 2009. Maybe he is. Or maybe Stafford’s talent and learning ability beat Culpepper’s experience, and Stafford really gives us the best chance to win right away. I think either situation is at least a reasonable possibility.
And honestly, I’m really looking forward to seeing what Stafford can do after hearing all the positive buzz. I really am. And I was totally on the “Draft Aaron Curry” bandwagon.
But I believe that if we start Stafford right away “because he needs experience”, or “because that’s what the Colts did with Manning”, or “because we’re in a rebuilding year”, or “because the fans want to see our talented new rookie”, then we’re starting him for the wrong reasons.
We should not play Stafford for any other reason than because he’s the best QB available that Sunday. If Culpepper is the best option in the immediate term to win games, then I’m fine with him starting right away.
by n4ry4 on Jun 30, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lots of great points here, n4ry4
The only thing I’m not necessarily sure about is if Culpepper is really that much better than Stafford right now as we speak. That’s a bold statement, I know, but I think we all need to take a step back and look at Culpepper with a little scrutiny. A lot of people are taking many liberties with saying Culpepper is a good quarterback. He WAS a good quarterback. The last few years, he’s been a downright lousy quarterback. Yeah, injury… blah, blah, blah. He’s played bad. Just because he lost a few pounds doesn’t mean we should necessarily expect Culpepper to be this completely different QB. Me personally…. I think he’s lost it. Maybe he’ll be a serviceable back-up, who knows? Maybe he proves me wrong. I was wrong once back in 1989, so it’s possible (kidding). I’m ready for the Stafford era to begin. No use messing with CP as starter. That’s just a time waster to me. I’m sure you agree with me too, KDawg :) Remember, I AM JOKING!
Anyway…. Go Stafford!
by DrewsLions on Jun 30, 2009 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you a midnight toker too?
lol….Steve Miller Band….
Anyway, you know what I think and I am not going to waste time saying the same thing over and over. All I have to say is that you do not understand why I think DC will be successful this year, and I do not understand why you discount his injury, the fact that he has not had a full offseason with one team until this year, that he was never fully recovered from his injury until he was retired and came back, that he was 30 pounds overweight when he came back and had no time whatsoever to prepare to play (he was immediately thrust into the starting role), that his determination and desire to be the man this year is undeniable, and that he was a very good QB before and could very easily be one again. Ronnie Brown is a prime example of what can happen when a man is determined to succeed. Yeah he is younger and all, and in a different position, but he is also in a position where his knees take more of a pounding in the NFL.
I agree that DC has been a lousy QB over the past 3.5 seasons…..but it is a very rare, if not non-existant occasion when a QB comes back from what was a career ending injury by most accounts. Ronnie Brown, at RB, is the only exception to the rule that I can think of. He played badly for multiple good reasons. You can argue all you want that there is no excuse, but I will call it shortsighted and biased at the very least. If you want to see the Lions move to L.A. or somewhere else, we can blindly start rookie after rookie at QB, without regard to who has a better chance of putting wins on the team’s record. I for one love this team more than that, and hope that they do what is best for the team, in starting the players that give us the best chance to win at all times, rather than starting players that could be of a lesser caliber. Prove that you have what it takes to be the best man for the job, and I will support you 100%. Get the job and not be the best man for it, and I will hate you, boo you, and call for your immediate removal.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Love SMB!
I do understand to some extent why you think CP might make it back this year. I don’t agree, but can understand it. With the injury stuff… yeah, I know that’s tough one. I was being facetious and busting your footballs a little. Contrary to my written opinions, I will support CP 100% if he wins the job. But start screwing up…. like you said, boos, hatred and those calls for immediate removal will start in earnest. Maybe it’s unfair, but I give rookies much more room for screw-ups versus seasoned vets. Actually, I think it is fair.
by DrewsLions on Jun 30, 2009 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again, I agree with that
See my reply to ahtrap below…..
If Daunte is the starter on day 1 and the Lions are 0-4 with him at the helm, I will be yelling for his head right next to you, as long as it is not the fault of the defense. At that point, I would be more than happy to see what the kid has.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dauntless starts the season, Stafford finishes it if necessary...
It really won’t matter WHO leads us out of the darkness, but rather when that leadership will arise. I have been impressed with Culpepper’s evident re-building of himself, the look in his eyes warns of some 4K season(s) might be left in him. On the other hand, I love our first pick (though I admit I didn’t understand it at first) and believe that he is the eventual face of the franchise. Cudos to the Mayhew Crew and, though you all might not like to hear it, LONG LIVE WCF!
by myPride on Jul 2, 2009 7:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He couldn't have made a better argument...
We, as Lions fans, need to get our bearings back and allow the team to build. We’ve been burned. Many times. But the argument he makes in this article is true. We can’t get hungry for immediate success. We want long term success so the team builds a foundation.
Let Stafford work right away. I trust Schwartz to lead him right. I trust that Stafford is strong-willed. I’ve seen it. He’s a competitor…not the same type of deer in the headlights look as Harrington.
Before reading this article, I was on the fence with the issue….leaning towards Culpepper to start. After, I am convinced that the time is now.
GO LIONS! RESTORE THE ROAR!
by Twon82 on Jun 30, 2009 2:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Actually, Prisco’s hype job moved me in the other direction. He made a point about how the Lions would take to year 3 of the Schwartz regime to have a shot at the playoffs if Stafford were to sit this year. Well, guess what, that’s probably going to be the case regardless. I’m not a fan of just giving the reins over to a guy because he’s the hot shot #1 pick. If he’s the better option at quarterback, then Schwartz should start him. If Culpepper is the better guy at the start of the season, then he should start.
Know this, though, regardless of who start, the Lions will have a losing season in 2009. If Culpepper starts and gets off to a rocky start, you can bring in Stafford at that point and let him take his shot. But if you start Stafford, and the season goes downhill, what will the Lions do then? Leave him in there to continue taking a beating on the scoreboard, and perhaps even on the field? Or yank him in favor of Culpepper, and risk damaging the Stafford ego?
The best quarterback, as determined in practice and pre-season play, as assessed by Jim Schwartz, should be under center when the regular season begins. If that is Matthew Stafford, so be it. But all else beng equal, and assuming similar performances in those pre-season games, etc, I’d be putting Culpepepr into the game, if I were Schwarz….
Official BYB Juju Consultant...now accepting rally creature applications!
by ahtrap on Jun 30, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
I agree with you 100% ahtrap. What will happen if Stafford starts from day 1, is not ready, and the season goes downhill? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. He will continue to play, no matter how bad he is, even if he is terrible. I agree that starting DC at the beginning of the season, at the very least, would be the smartest move the Lions coaching staff could make. That way if DC sucks and isn’t getting the job done, we can bring in the rook and not have to worry about what happens if he sucks too. If all 3 Lion QB’s suck, at least there will be no hard feelings over a QB merry-go-round. In that case, hopefully every one of them will get playing time so we can weed out the bad and keep the good. Handing the controls over to Matt Stafford immediately would basically tell Daunte Culpepper that he can look elsewhere to play, because he will not be around in 2010 if he gets beat out by the rook. I am not against that idea, if in fact Matt Stafford is just as good or better than DC when the season starts. However, if Daunte Culpepper has something left in the tank, not only would it be the best thing for the team to start him this year to benefit from the wins that we may possibly gain from that venture, but also it would be best for the team to showcase his value in the event that they want to attempt trading him in the offseason or sooner.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 8:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Defeatist mentality
That was my whole point. Too worried about losing right now. We will…regardless. Stafford needs to get in there and learn like the Mannings, Matt Ryan, Aikman, and so forth.
GO LIONS! RESTORE THE ROAR!
by Twon82 on Jun 30, 2009 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea Right
what an idiot prisco is…he claims its david carr’s fault for getting sacked 70 something times his rookie year…riiiiiiiiiiiiiiight
you can attribute a good amount of sacks to a qb…his play, mental capacity, leadership, etc, but come on…70 + sacks is still 70 + sacks….to me this article loses all credibility with that statement…
by youtalkintome7 on Jun 30, 2009 2:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Great article
I totally agree with this article, I too was on the fence but I think the time is now. Oh and Prisco never said it was all the QB’s fault for all of his sacks, he said that Carr was not deicated. I think that the reason that we want Stafford to sit is because of Harrington and Andre Ware. But after reading this article I think that we should just throw him out there. Besides who here honestly thinks that we are even going to get to 500 this year, let alone the playoffs.
I also think that our offensive line is vastly better than last year, I think that it is the best line that we have had in a long time, and that is sad because the line is still not that good, plus they are old, but it is better than last year.
So I say throw Stafford out there, finish with 5 or 6 wins and get a top 5 tackle next year.
by lionfan4life on Jun 30, 2009 2:54 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
after re-reading...
you’re right, i didn’t get the full context the first time around…sorry pete!
anyways…i suppose he makes valid points for staff to start game 1…but i still feel the lions o-line isn’t fully there yet…at the very least, all the new talent they have needs time to “gel” together in game situations…i suppose having staff in there now would be part of the gelling process…
by youtalkintome7 on Jun 30, 2009 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
did anyone read Prisco's top 50 players list?
This is the same fool that put Andre Johnson as the BEST WR in the NFL. Need I say more? I ofcourse want Culpizzle to play this year and have Stafford sit it out but he does have a valid point you can only get better if your in game situations.
by davis0169 on Jun 30, 2009 3:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
He never did mention anything about Aaron Rodgers. He sat for a couple years, came in and did pretty good. Although one could argue that he would have been WAY better(this last season) if Favre had left earlier, giving Rodgers more snaps.
by BIGWalt2990 on Jun 30, 2009 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uh.. what's wrong with Andre Johnson?
Not many receivers better than him. Fitzgerald or CJ maybe. I’d take him.
by DrewsLions on Jun 30, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I love AJ
He is my #1 Fantasy WR right now….in my keeper league.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fantasy Football already? Rosters haven’t been finalized, offseason acquisitions, etc..
by BIGWalt2990 on Jul 1, 2009 7:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's a keeper league
So I still have my entire roster from last year…..I have to choose 5 players to keep. The league hasn’t even been created this year yet. We do the league on Yahoo, and will probably draft in August sometime (last week or so).
In fact, if any of you guys are interested……I would appreciate some opinions on who I should keep and who I should let go. I finished 2nd last year, so now I also draft 2nd to last. Sean, is it ok to post about fantasy football and ask for opinions here on POD?
by KDawg on Jul 1, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Definitely pick up Stafford... I hear he's going to be..
a sure-fire starter and rookie of the year. Oh yeah, my sources are Pete Prisco and myself :)
by DrewsLions on Jul 1, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very funny Drew.....
However, I had already considered that idea…..LOL!
by KDawg on Jul 1, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My roster is stacked too....
I already have Favre and McNabb…..but I am considering dropping both because of the talent level of the rest of my potential keepers. I have Chris Johnson, Steve Slaton, Brian Westbrook, Brandon Marshall, Andre Johnson, Bernard Berrian, Jason Witten, and Tony Gonzalez. I have others (like the Ravens D, Dominic Hixon, Pierre Thomas, and Tim Hightower) who I consider expendable. It is a PPR league, and we score pts for TD’s, receptions, yards, completions, etc…..
I can only keep 5 guys. At this point in time I am having difficulty deciding whether or not to keep Westbrook and Marshall….Westy is the man when healthy, but he’s not getting younger. Marshall is a holdout and will likely be playing in Denver, unhappy and with Orton passing to him. Favre and McNabb are tempting, but I might try to pick up a solid starter with my first pick (7 of 8) in round 1 and snag up a guy like Stafford later (however I might have to draft him first to get him, if he is even there at pick 7, since I play with 7 other Lions fans). I can play both Witten and Gonzo at the same time if I please….and I think they are as good as many receivers, fantasy wise. I am leaning towards keeping Chris Johnson, Steve Slaton, Andre Johnson, Witten, and Gonzo. Any thoughts?
by KDawg on Jul 1, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
By the way
I own the rights to every layer on my roster at the end of last season, until the draft. I can trade players with other league members (for players or draft picks) up until the draft. I am considering shopping McNabb and/or Marshall to see what I can get.
by KDawg on Jul 1, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Those five keepers sound good
The only one I’d be worried about is Slaton…might hit the sophomore wall. Same for Chris Johnson as well. Personally, I’d keep McNabb, I think Philly are up for a big season.
2009 = The start of the Lions Golden Age (We hope).
by Hyperion Ecta on Jul 1, 2009 9:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks HE
I too have thought about the sophomore slump with Johnson and Slaton, but they were so spectacular last year and are ranked so high that it would be very difficult for me to cut (especially since the two of them carried me a lot last year). Gonzo in Atlanta should be awesome (and should take away from Roddy White a bit too), and Andre Johnson may be one of the most consistent fantasy threats at WR in the NFL. Witten is Witten, but will the Boys be the Boys without TO? Will Witten draw more attention as teams will not be forced to double TO anymore? Who would you cut to keep McNabb? It is a tough question for me at this point.
by KDawg on Jul 1, 2009 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Personally, I’d take out Slaton and keep McNabb. I’ve been very impressed with Slaton but I just don’t think he will be able to replicate what he achieved last season and like I said before, I see a big season from McNabb.
It seems as if to me, you seem slightly apprehensive about Witten. I think he’ll stay pretty steady. Without TO, Witten will be Romo’s top man and a guy of his talent is gonna get a lot of receptions. If anything, I’d be more worried about Gonzo…he’s got White to contend with and I think Ryan might struggle in his second year, he’s not an unknown quantity anymore. So, I expect Gonzo to take a small hit in production.
In saying that though, it’s all your decision…go with your gut, it seems to work for ya.
2009 = The start of the Lions Golden Age (We hope).
by Hyperion Ecta on Jul 2, 2009 1:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I also think McNabb will have a big year
I am just asking for opinions….hoping to solidify my own opinion. My chief concern is that the Fantasy league I am in is RB poor. Everyone keeps their good RB’s and it always seems like there is a good QB available. However, when RB’s are gone, QB usually is next, then WR’s……on one hand I am afraid to cut McNabb because I am not sure I will be able to get him back. On the other hand I am afraid to cut Slaton or Westbrook too. I agree with you about Gonzo…..but he is always in the top 3 of the TE rankings. He had Bowe to contend with last year, but he always gets open and he always gets his catches and TD’s. Having both Witten and Gonzo (like 2 of the top 3 TE’s) could be very good. But also, not having a QB is Fantasy suicide. You see my dilemma?
by KDawg on Jul 2, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can you play both TEs or just one per week?
I like Chris Johnson, Steve Slaton, Andre Johnson, Witten, and ………Brandon Marshall.
But that last choice is a tough one.
by NorthLeft12 on Jul 2, 2009 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
I can play a TE and a TE/WR Flex. Both are scored exactly the same.
I like Marshall a lot too, but I am afraid that his situation is not very good. If he is traded, however, he will pull a Randy Moss on me. I had Randy Moss as a rookie and kept him until he had his bad year in Oakland. I traded him, and he was traded to NE….much to my chagrin.
How do I justify dropping Gonzo or Witten? This is the most difficult my decision has ever been on who to keep and who to cut. It is equally difficult to justify dropping Slaton…Johnson and Johnson are definite keepers.
by KDawg on Jul 2, 2009 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your definetly in a tough spot KD
Do you have your eye on any replacements?
2009 = The start of the Lions Golden Age (We hope).
by Hyperion Ecta on Jul 2, 2009 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Honestly
There isn’t much in the way of RB replacements…I would be looking at rookies or players that other teams drop. Most everyone in the league keeps their RB’s and QB’s. WR’s are thin and the elite ones are usually kept as well. Last year I traded LaDainian Tomlinson, Ocho Cinco, and Eddie Royal (in the 1st half of the season) for Marshall, Westbrook, and Andre Johnson. I was trying to sell high on LT, and it looked like I had the better of the deal until this offseason.
Now I might have to drop two of those 3 players. LT had been a keeper for me since he was a rookie. I had planned on keeping Westbrook, Marshall, and AJ, but with Westbrook’s injury history, offseason surgery, the Eagles drafting and signing of LeSean McCoy, the departure of Cutler from Denver and the arrival of Orton, Marshall’s trade demands and off field issues, and my own lack of confidence in Kyle Orton have lead me to questioning the value of keeping any of the three besides AJ.
As you know, I plan to keep Chris Johnson for sure. So Johnson and Johnson are locks. I am afraid that Dallas is going to struggle this year, and Gonzo is also in a ? situation. McNabb was good for me most of the time last year, but does he still have what it takes to carry my team fantasy wise, or will he get injured again or play inconsistently like he has at times in the past? Slaton is a threat both running and recieving. I think he will continue to be a threat. He seems to be in a stronger position than Westbrook, and considering the lack of solid fantasy backs in my league, I am strongly leaning towards keeping him over Westbrook. The real question marks for me are the 2 TE’s and Slaton, obviously.
Maybe I should keep my 3 RB’s, AJ, and McNabb and hope to get either Witten or Gonzo early in the draft. Maybe I should look to trade one of the 2 TE’s or Westbrook for a QB. It is July, and I am already worried about this because of the difficulty level involved. Thanks for your ideas.
by KDawg on Jul 2, 2009 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ridiculous?
What I find ridiculous is throwing Daunte Culpepper under the bus and starting Stafford even if he is not the best QB on the roster. I took the time to read some of the fans responses after the article. I found this interesting and agree with it:
My biggest point is that while playing some early helped (Manning, Ryan) sitting may have helped for others (Montana, Brady, Favre, Brees, and a lot more). Prisco states that Carr was just not up to the task, well the opposite would also be true, if Manning sat a year he probably would have succeeded anyway and been up to the task. Montana may have been successful if he started right away but maybe he wouldn’t have, we’ll just never know.
http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/messages/thread/15814391
Lastly, come on guys…..this article was written by Pete Prisco of CBSSports.com…..the same site that “Hey Hey RalphieBOY” always looked to when he was trying to prove his point. I rarely agree with anything that comes from CBSSports….and this is no exception. Until Matt Stafford is the best QB on the roster, meaning he has to BEAT Daunte Culpepper for the job, then he has to sit in my opinion. I think that starting Daunte (unless Matt is just obviously that much better, upon which time when I see it with my own eyes, my opinion and stance will change) at the beginning of the year AT A MINIMUM is a much smarter move than just tossing him aside, if he is playing well, for an unproven rookie QB. Yeah yeah….Atlanta did it with Ryan, and Indy did it with Peyton…..who were their other options again?? The 1998 Colts and the 2008 Falcons had NO other options. Both teams went into the season with only 1 QB!! The Colts had a WR playing backup QB (Torrence Small), and I am sure there was a similar emergency guy in Atlanta last year. Eli Manning ended up starting 7 games, for the Giants, and playing in 9 in 2004 when he was drafted (by the Chargers….LOL). They had another guy who everyone said was washed up, all done, no longer servicable…..his name is Kurt Warner.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 3:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
you sir...
make solid points. And I do hope that Culpepper is the new Warner. At the very least let culpepper play with the first team through the preseason so I feel better when stafford struggles in his early starts.
Maybe, just once, someone will call me "sir" without adding, "you're making a scene.
by HireMattMillen on Jun 30, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
KDawg...
We found Culpepper already under the bus, so Prisco was simply putting him back where we found him.
Still not sure why you feel CP is going to be so great this year. I think he’s damaged good. Also, I still think there is something to the element of potential involved here. I know you don’t see this the same way, but I believe that you can justify a few less wins this year playing Stafford to help in his grooming of the future. Yes… even if he is not the best quarterback (but gotta be fairly close). There is nothing like experience in this league and Stafford can’t get it on the bench. I think that was Prisco’s main point. I’m not much for Petey Boy either, but his point here is valid. Culpepper is simply not in the long-term plans of the Lions, so if Stafford is progressing through camp, throw him in and let him take his lumps. CP is an insurance policy.
BTW… I posted this article simply so you and I could have Round 2. Again… JOKING!
by DrewsLions on Jun 30, 2009 7:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL
Ding ding……;o)
I see his point and I will raise it 2.
1) Matt Stafford is a rookie, and we have another option. If that Veteran option is the best for the team right now, he has to play. Peyton Manning and Matt Ryan were thrown in right away because those teams had no other options. Winning games is what is important to this organization right now. If the Lions do not win and win soon, the fans will stop going to the games and the Lions will be forced to put out or get out. It is a game, but it is also a business. In that aspect, for the love of GOD and FANS, may the BEST MAN WIN!
2) I have said this over and over….Daunte Culpepper has finally had a FULL offseason with the same team!! He has gotten himself into the best shape of his career. He is with his old OC, he knows the system well and what is expected of him. He was successful under Linehan’s system before. He is (contrary to popular belief) a very accurate QB who would rather take a sack than force throws or make bad decisions. He has pocket presence AND the ability to avoid the rush (and if his mobility comes back to at least 80% of what it was 5 years ago….we will be watching “the roll” many times this season). He has the next Randy Moss (if not better) and at least two other average WR’s to throw to. He has an up and coming stud RB. He has an improved O-Line in front of him. He has another big, and new, target in Pettigrew. He has all of the tools to succeed. That is why I think he will be great this year.
Yeah REV….that was like 20 points…..lol
Now, I am not saying that Matt Stafford does not have a lot of those same things. And again, if he can show that he is just as good as Daunte Culpepper, then by all means he should start. He IS the future of the Lions. If he fails, we are back to square 1. I do not disagree with Prisco, you, or NL on that point. What I will never agree with is the idea of playing Matt Stafford no matter what, just because he was the number 1 pick, just because the media thinks he is the answer in Detroit, just because he could be the long term solution in Detroit, just because he needs to get real game experience, just because he is confident, or any other reason other than he is just as good or better than Daunte Culpepper. If he is not, then he will benefit from watching the game from the sidelines and continuing to take snaps in practice, just like Joe Montana, Brett Favre, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers etc etc did.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree with your last paragraph 100%
by NorthLeft12 on Jun 30, 2009 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well Fuc* me it's a miracle.....
We all agree?? Move over Alice….this might be the big one.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
remember pads aren't on yet
I do agree with kdawg on the points that Culpepper will play better this year than he has since 2004 because he is rehabbed and has his old OC and has IMO a pretty good receiving corp highlighted by CJ. plus an Oline that actually has an OC and oline coach worth a sh*t.
I also agree that stafford should play if he is the better QB. BUT we cannot find this out until they get their pads on at the end of July. Personally i think we are beating the horse dead before it leaves the stable (it is still offseason and this is to be expected)
Without seeing how they handle game situations we really won’t know who is better.
One other point, regardless of what Prisco, you, me or anyone else says, Schwartz already said that the best player will play. Matt will play if he is ready and is the best QB. i think it is the right approach as do most you from the sounds of things.
"If your not with us...
you're with the terrorists!!"
by alpha lion on Jul 1, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am sick of hearing...
The lions gave up more sacks than anyone…Uh…thats because they were behind by 3 TDs and the defensese knew they had to pass…if a DE knows is a pass, he will get more pressure and thus, more sacks…if he had to be aware of a screen or a draw or dare I say it…a dive…then he would be a little more hesitant on 1st and 2nd down at least….If you look at sacks per passing play I am sure they werent as far behind other teams, likley not even at the bottom…I say start Matt, and let him get his brains knocked out…or not!….just start him..lets move on.
by CapitolLions on Jun 30, 2009 4:17 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Actually the Niners gave up more sacks in 2008 [55].
The Lions gave up 52 sacks. Both teams attempted 509 passes. So you are right CL, the Lions were not the worst. The Bengals, Vikings and Raiders were not far behind the top two in sacks given up per pass attempts. The Raiders and Vikings did not throw that much so their lower sack totals covered up this problem a bit.
by NorthLeft12 on Jun 30, 2009 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Funny...
I thought the Viks O-Line was “All World”
by CapitolLions on Jun 30, 2009 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think 'All-World' refers more to their run blocking ability
2009 = The start of the Lions Golden Age (We hope).
by Hyperion Ecta on Jun 30, 2009 7:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not to piss anyone off, but their lousy QBs and WRs have a hand in the high sack totals.
Receivers that can’t get open and two horrible QBs [Jackson and Frerotte] don’t help the O Line.
by NorthLeft12 on Jun 30, 2009 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He will take that argument to the grave....
So it is pointless to argue with him…..he’s stubborn.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 8:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Being right will do that to a person!
Ka Ching!
by NorthLeft12 on Jun 30, 2009 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My Take
We are in the win (relatively) regardless of which direction we go.
Daunte stepped up and is doing his damndest to win the starting job. What more can you ask out of a past pro-bowler to approach the season “like it’s his rookie year”? So, check on Culpepper. He deserves a shot.
Staff has shined above pretty much every single rookie that’s been drafted thus far. Sure he was #1 overall. Sure he’s a QB. But you name one rookie draftee who’s generated as much buzz and shown as much to the NFL community than Staff. I was DEAD SET against drafting this kid. He’s came and turned me (a known contrarian) into a believer.
If we start Daunte, fine. I have no problem with that. I lean towards that so he can take the beating while the OL gains cohesion. Halfway through the season if Daunte gets injured (not that big of a reach) or just isn’t getting the job done, give it over to Staff. I think either way, the job is only Daunte’s for a limited time, which also works in our favor; he doesn’t want this to be his last year in the NFL, and if he’s only gonna start 6 or 8 weeks, I’d be willing ot be this is gonna be the hardest half year he’s ever worked at.
Bottom line: We actually have a good predicament at QB. Let’s let the coaches coach and see what happens.
by Nate D. on Jun 30, 2009 6:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Completely agree
You Nate, have summed up my feelings.
As far as I’m concerned, Staff is the future of the Lions, we all know this. But right now, at this very moment and coming up to this season, it’s an open competition. I’m expecting Daunte to start this season but I wouldn’t be surprised to see Staff pushing Daunte quite hard this camp.
As far as this article goes, I don’t put to much stock into it, we all have talked quite a lot about each scenario and there are very solid points to each side. I’m just looking forward to the start of this training camp…let the competition begin.
2009 = The start of the Lions Golden Age (We hope).
by Hyperion Ecta on Jun 30, 2009 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure you guys appreciate me...
drumming up this beat again! What else is there to do? And know that I was not in anyway biased when posting this article ;)
Naw, I want Culpepper to get a fair shake…. just not at Staff’s expense. If he’s capable this year, then start him. I do agree with Petey Prisco that there is no use wasting time on Culpepper if Matt is capable this year.
by DrewsLions on Jun 30, 2009 7:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
And thus we agree.....finally
IF Matt Stafford is as good as or better than Daunte Culpepper…..he should be the starter from day 1.
by KDawg on Jun 30, 2009 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
coaching will make the difference ...BUT SO WILL SELL TICKETS
you heard our lineman say blocking schemes were a mess , and our offense was dull and predictabe …OUR NEW COACHES WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE …no newbees and wanabees in the whole group …THEY HAVE A PLAN …that will make the biggest difference ….I said before , matt millen picked top players that had good draft board ratings , and then would put them with lousy coaches and ruin them from the start …so my point is , no matter who starts , the results will be well coached and more organized ..but I really think new coach and new quarterback should be hooked at the hip …and old man ford wart face will probably require it considering the investment ….and that could be the end of the story …. SELL TICKETS …..
marc hoople
by spinitnow on Jun 30, 2009 9:54 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
AND WHAT I SAID .....
ABOUT MILLEN ….is true …before the 4th round ….all our picks were top rated …but were miserable failures for the most part bcause of bad coaching ….
marc hoople
by spinitnow on Jun 30, 2009 9:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

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