BPA
by rocketman989 on Mar 17, 2010 10:17 PM EDT
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There has been a lot of talk about the lions brass saying that they are going to pick the best player avaliable regardless of need.Thats crap,and i think the lions see that.Not saying that they need to reach like millen did with cherlus and dizon.They need to pick the best player avaliable that is going to help us win!!! The lions have had a half ass offencive line for the last ten years.Thats the major reason why they cant get it together.Every teem that wins has a good offencive line.They need to draft a left tackle ,or if they think its not worth the draft slot then trade down.Not saying defense dosent win but with the rules today you have to score points.I hope Martin gets it, and I think he does .So lets put our hopes on the lions doing the right thing.They cant do much worse than millen and ford did to destroy our team.
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rumor has it that Pittsburgh's o-line is subpar and they seem to win....
Stick to the BPA plan.
if the shoe fits...get another one just like it - George Carlin
Horrible analogy...
Here’s another one…Toyota kills people but they still sell millions of cars. Huh? Your cause and effect needs some work. How about a killer defense, some good WR’s and a clutch QB having something to do with it? Also, Stafford is not the same QB as Big Ben and their winning styles ( and their teams subsequent drafting styles) should be different. We need to protect our investment, not ruin him like some previous administrations.
by damnitdamnitdamnit on Mar 18, 2010 3:27 AM EDT up reply actions
your analogy is horrible...
before Toyota can kill people. They have to sell the cars……
if the shoe fits...get another one just like it - George Carlin
I'm pretty sure
The NY Jets made it to the AFC championship without scoring a TD all season.
But seriously, I’m thankful our fanbase now has a logical, math-minded, goal-oriented upper management running the show now. The Lions aren’t necessarily adhering to a philosophy that suggests “If Sam Bradford is our highest-rated player we have to take him!” Need obviously plays a part, and this staff obviously knows what positions need to be replenished – but that doesn’t mean they’re going to stick their heads in the sand and ignore top-notch players for the sake of finding, say, a LT(which they already have dude, sorry). Everyone wanted an OT or MLB with our second 1st last year. People couldn’t imagine a different choice. Well they went with their top-rated player, and Pettigrew fills a huge role as a receiver and blocker for this team. Mayhew and Schwartz FTW.
Pigeon-holing things by saying “we can’t win without amazing Oline omg” is false, and thank God that Schwartz understands this. The player who grades out as the best FIT for this team will be taken at #2. Whether it be Suh, Okung, Berry, or somebody else – I have faith that this organization will have made the most sensible choice in THEIR minds. Not ours.
apart from starting QB,
im pretty sure every position could be upgraded. BPA.
Sorry...
but I just had to respond to this… WR1, FS, TE1 and the position you mentioned are absolute dead locks. There is a reason teams win, and isn’t just drafting BPA after BPA after BPA. At some point you have to do exactly what Schwartz has said he will do, and that is BPA at positions of need. If that is DT then by all means… they are the experts after all, but please stop just saying BPA, please tell us why that position actually needs to be upgraded.
by damnitdamnitdamnit on Mar 18, 2010 3:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Of course,
You have to have a team first….LMAO!
WTF people? If the Lions get to 8-8 next year, it will be a miracle! This team is so screwed up, talent wise, that its retarded. Don’t act the fool and draft by position. This team needs talent.
Here’s to 2011, when the Lions will have 3 solid years of drafted talent supporting their team.
You’re a fool if you believe the lions need a certain player here or there to be competitive.
-CLF
There is over a month left before the draft, I would not say we HAVE to have an OL yet.
For one thing everyone picks on the LG spot, true its been a hole, but IMO the center position is just as horrible. We can run anything up the middle because Raiola is too undersized to get a run block. He gets totally owned by the big defensive tackles like Pat Williams. Backus is an ok LT is he is healthy and Jansen can step in if Cherilus cant step up. WE actually would do much better to go for a player like Maurkice Pouncy who can step in and start for us at center or guard than a LT IMO. And Pouncy is a late round 1 pick so we are not likely to get him unless he slides some. Asamoah is as good a prospect IMO as Iupati, I think Iupati is way over rated. We can get Asamoah in round 3. So they can still take BPA in round 1 and shore up the OL. ALso signing Chester Pitts, if he is healthy, would go a LONG way to helping us.
Here's the difference
There isn’t ANYONE in the LG spot. We have guys who are normally backups and third stringers filling that hole. At center we have an undersized guy who has years in the league. I think despite his previous issues, Raiola does a great job. If we had a solid interior line (Petertears does NOT count), both our tackles AND our undersized center would benefit exponentially. When a ‘decent’ LT, a developing RT, and an undersized C all have to compensate for having NO ONE next to them, it’s terrible.
Get us some guards, and I think we’ll see a vast improvement.
I agree Nate...
However, could you guys please stop calling him PeterTears? The guy is a frickin warrior that gives a shit. He played both ways in critical situations last year, and does everything asked of him.
The fact that he shed a tear after our first win in a year and a half shouldn’t label the guy a pussy. In fact, if we had more guys that cared enough to break down in tears on the field when we finally won a game we probably wouldn’t have lost so many consecutive games.
I cried when they won too, and there aren’t too many guys on POD except for NYC that would call me a pussy to my face. Don’t get me wrong, i still think NYC is a pussy but I am just saying with his size he might feel brave enough to call me a pussy too. lol.
I don’t mean to single you out Nate, cuz I don’t think you were the catalyst in that nickname here. He is OUR teammate with a long term deal, and we need to support him instead of tearing him down.
Just give me 25 guys on the last year of their contracts; I'll win a pennant every year....Sparky Anderson
Oh, I'll take that
I’m pretty sure I’m the person who made it up, and I also think I’m the only person who uses that nickname…
With that said, I hardly agree that Peter Man is a ‘warrior’, or a ‘stalwart’ on our team. He was cut after being a 3rd round pick by the Cowboys, and ended up on our practice squad… With how great our depth is he ended up on the roster and continues the trend of underachieving hard workers who get contracts for no real reason.
The reason I gave him the Petertears name is because dude cried when we won said game after starting for us for about a season and a half. I realize that losing takes its toll on people, but it’s not like the guy is Jason Hanson or even Backus. He was with the team for a total of two years, one of them seeing us go 6-2 at a point. So apparently he’s a super emotional guy, and I don’t even see that as a negative. If you’re a NFL player who cries alot, fine. But he’s certainly not an answer at RG, and thus I use said nickname.
Guess we’ll have to agree to disagree, but I definitely am looking forward to the day that guys like Peterman are quality depth players, nothing more.
If you believe in Schwartz and Mayhew...
then you should believe in peterman. Not only did schwartz have him serve double duty on the defensive line in critical situations last year, but he and MM signed him to a 5 year deal last June.
He was a 3rd rd pick of Parcells, which is where he likes to draft OL. He got hurt a couple of times, and Parcells never gave him a chance after that. But he started around 37 of 42 games after we got him and before the season ending injury.
Can we have it both ways? MM is doing a great job, but the guy he signed to a 5 year deal 9 months ago is nothing more than a bench player?
Nate, I know you watch more game replays where you isolate by position than I do so I will defer to you. I thought he was the best player on our OL before he got hurt. Do you think we should draft two guards this year and have open competition for RG? If so, this is the year to do it as there is no cap hit if he can’t cut the mustard.
Just give me 25 guys on the last year of their contracts; I'll win a pennant every year....Sparky Anderson
I refuse to give carte blanche to the FO
I am fully on board with the front office, but I would never say that just because I feel that way, I don’t question anything they do. I was praying Peterman and Raiola would both be gone when they got extensions, and I think that their signings were moreso due to the knowledge that if we let those guys go, chances were that we would be getting worse players in. The lesser of two evils, if you will. And just because he played a couple of defensive downs doesn’t mean much. Maybe he has some experience on D. Maybe he’s just a big guy who we could plug in there. If I recall correctly, he was on the field for some field goals and a couple goal line stand, 4th down scenarios. That’s a time where you put as many big bodies as you have out there, and you’re certainly not going to put Cherilus or Backus out there, being our major contributors at T.
Backus is, unfortunately our best OL. Raiola is behind him and I would say Cherilus and Peterman are about tied for 3rd/last… Which is either saying alot for Peterman or very little for Cherilus, depending on how you look at it.
I think we need to draft one guard. If we signed a very good guard to play either position, I would not object to drafting another in the 3rd or 4th to compete with Peterman, but without signing a FA, yes, I’d rather have Stephen there than 2 rookies on the OL. Like I said, here, Peterman is an alright starter. You put him on a team with a quality offensive line like the Cowboys, he gets cut or sent to the practice squad. I’m all about players with heart and emotion and all that, but there is a line where that takes a backseat to talent. I’d rather have a talented heartless team than vice versa.
footstock..
I may not be big enough to call you a pussy but I do carry a M-4 since I am in Afghanistan. Further more I would not call you a pussy since we always shot each others thoughts down on here and I enjoy that to much. 3rd as I agree on supporting our long term contract players, its a buisness in which we do need to point out our weakness as well as strength them or cultivate a player behind them to eventually replace them. So I think your both right. And for the record I did not call you a pussy…….I have to eventually turn the M-4 back in when I go back state side !!! LOL
Hey there Joey...
A military brother!
I was a cop in the air force and a marksmen with the .38, the m-16, the 203 grenade launcher, and the m-60 machine gun. Those came in handy as I was in SAC.
Take care of yourself over there brother! If I could have your back, I would have your back!
Just give me 25 guys on the last year of their contracts; I'll win a pennant every year....Sparky Anderson
Well said Footstock
Same people that get on Delhommes case for being upset that he was traded. You have to realise these guys are family and you know what as much as you may hate a player the fact is he goes out there on sunday and subjects his body to things we can’t even imagine. The had been threw EVERYTHING imagine the kind of weight those 0-16 players had lifted off there shoulders. Notice my Icon I am sure you have it is stafford walking off the field after victory number1. I picked it because as a Lions fan it was one of my proudest moments because we had hit bottom and all hope was lost after the 0-16. Matthew lifting his hand in the air in victory was a special moment for me because I supported drafting him from day one. I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t a little coked up myself.
How do you keep a running back out of your secondary? You put up a LEVY.
by The Profiler on Mar 18, 2010 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Totally different story
Delhomme spent his entire starting career (7 of 9 years) in Carolina. He nearly won a Super Bowl against the Patriots (losing by a single field goal) and was definitely the center piece of that team. Peterman had no history anywhere near that to be crying… Like I said, I don’t hate on the guy for being emotional, but he’s the last person I pictured being like that… shit, if it was anyone it should have been Backus, Raiola, or Hanson, like I said.
but he was here for every one of the 0-16 losses.
That would be like you and I going to work every day for a year and having a shitty day—-EVERY DAY. Imagine that!
If you sit through a year of bad days and have a good one, you have earned the right to cry. In fact, you could make a case that it was worse for him than Backus or Raiola. Backus and Dom saw the train wreck-a-comin for 7 years. It was a shock out of nowhere for Peterman. LOL.
By the way, Jason Hanson doesn’t qualify either way. He kicks a ball, and I appreciate it—-but frankly, well, he just kicks the ball. lol.
PS> Delhomme was only crying cuz his agent hadn’t yet told him that he was still going to get his $12 million whether he played or not. After that call, he was like “Oh? Nevermind.”
Just give me 25 guys on the last year of their contracts; I'll win a pennant every year....Sparky Anderson
I feel your passion my friend!
I love to hear that stuff…i really do!
Just give me 25 guys on the last year of their contracts; I'll win a pennant every year....Sparky Anderson
Jansen! JANSEN! Are you kidding me?!?
I still don’t understand why Jansen was re-signed. I suppose the Lions must think he is worth something, but last year he was not anywhere near starting material.
Very good Centers can be picked up in the second or even third rounds. JD Walton looks like a keeper and he seems to be valued at mid second to mid third round. Quality, long term LTs are not easy to find. Ones that can step in from day one are even harder.
The advantage of picking a durable, ready to start, high quality LT this year is our drafting position, our short term [LG] and long term [LT] need on O Line, and the player himself.
To me Okung has all the physical and technical tools you would want in an LT without any of the injuriy or character or history concerns that were identified in last years class of LTs [J.Smith, A. Smith, E. Monroe, M. Oher].
Having said that I am okay with picking Suh or McCoy or even Berry if that is what the Lions FO thinks is best. I can rationalize any of those picks. Some better than others.
character concerns
Okung looked like he wasn’t even giving all of his effort, yet he was still playing like a shut down LT. His athleticism is just too much for Des to handle even when he is taking it easy. He does need to get more aggressive however as he lacks a mean streak. I can’t wait to see him go up against a quality DE.
http://www.prodraftparty.com/2009/lt-russell-okung-scouting-report/
he is a lazy bum and i dont want him.. think back to big babay if a guy can get away with only giveing 50% it kills the locker room and everone feels they only need to give 50%.. i dont care if he still looked good the point is he was not giveing 110%.. and that what we need.. no a lazy bum like okung
This is this guy's opinion of what he saw and that is what you base your "character concerns" on?
The guy has played 47 straight games at Right or Left Tackle and has phenomenal numbers regarding his pass protection in that time. And that is against some pretty good talent from Oklahoma, Nebraska, Texas, Texas A&M, etc.
Some jackass watching video thinks he was loafing, yet he still shut his opponent down, and you buy that? Okung is not a reach at # 2 and looks like he can do a great job protecting Staff for the next decade. Sure he could be a better run blocker, but he is a prospect, not a finished prospect. I would be very happy if the Lions picked him.
by NorthLeft12 on Mar 18, 2010 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Dude, seriously?
Any draft site will list pro’s and con’s for each player they evaluate. And if you attempt to actually read what they wrote about Okung, you could translate them writing that “Okung looked like he wasn’t even giving all of his effort” to essentially being the same as them writing “Okung made it look easy”.
Read up on Suh and you’ll find out that he occasionally gets too high in his stance, and he has a history of knee problems. And Eric Berry is inconsistent when taking angles against a ball-carrier, which leads to him missing tackles. No prospect is perfect, can’t-miss, or a future Hall-of-Famer before they’ve ever set foot on an NFL field.
You may dislike the idea of the Lions drafting Okung, but he’s anything but a “lazy bum”, and he definitely does not come with “character concerns.”
Well said
"Zack Follett: he will hurt your mind." - Pride Leader, Sean Yuille, wielder of the Ban Hammer.
2010 Wests Tigers : Current record - 1-0 : Current Position - 8th : Last game - Defeated Manly Sea Eagles 26 -22
by Hyperion Ecta on Mar 19, 2010 4:41 AM EDT up reply actions
Some people are so good....
That when they play it looks " effort less ". I think that is what they are trying to say. What is wrong with a player NOT giving a 100% AND STILL shutting down the DE he is facing ?? To me that means he is that good and not challenged. I do agree he dosent have a mean streak and needs to get that. Dosent mean that he is lazy…just that much better.
so let me see if i understand you
reaching for gos was a bad thing.. but you want to rach for another OT this year?? tradeing back will not happen so get that out of your head… and okung is not worth top 5 let alone top 2.. in order to draft that high they need to be on the same level as thomes or long and okung is not.. bottum line is okung is a huge reach at 2..
First of all...
Okung is good… I’ll let the FO decide how good he really is. (I didn’t think Stafford was that good either)
Secondly, I still believe there is a slim chance the Lions can trade out of the #2. St Louis would be retarded for not drafting Bradford( he would’ve been a lion if he came out last year)… so that leaves Clausen….. Washington is definitely looking to draft this kid @ #4. Cleveland, Seattle, and Buffalo, could all make a jump….
Slim, but still a chance.
let be real if you take a lock at gerald mccoy is 1 dt on a lot of draft boareds and so is ndamukong suh if you lock at offensive line players and bpa is russell okung . so if your the lions gm and you have bad defensive last year but you have upgraded the defensive all ready this year by picking up a new de/cbs/dt/ this year in fa . but also have a offensiveline whoe coulnd not keep my 1pick in last year draft from getting hurt last year want do you do with your 2pickin the draft you should draft the bpa on the offensive line witch is russell okung and then go back to fixing the def or off with the bpa in later rds of this draft .
Backus wont look too bad
If we are able to draft Mike Johnson or Mitch Petrus to play Guard next to him
Never give up..we will be atop the NFL one day:)
ya
i stand by wanting to draft suh and then look at fixing the o line with later picks………i just dont feel that okung is worth the #2………..but, as said before……..we can let the people that get paid to make those decisions make them……….
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