If you want to trade down from #2, who should go to the Rams at #1?
by n4ry4 on Mar 3, 2010 10:23 AM EST
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PrintOk, suppose we're hoping for better value from a trade-down, in terms of salary impact, and the number of guys we can pick in the first few rounds, than simply picking somebody at #2 and paying him #2-overall money.
Who does St. Louis have to draft at #1 to make our #2 pick more desirable to the the teams drafting after us?
I am assuming that there are only three players St. Louis would consider at #1: Jimmy Clausen, Sam Bradford, and Ndamukong Suh. The Rams won't take Russell Okung (they took Jason Smith, LT, at #2 last year), Gerald McCoy (Suh is better), or Eric Berry (they're not paying a safety #1-overall money).
So, who needs to go at #1 to make an attractive trade-down from #2 most likely to happen?
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Pride of Detroit or its writers. FanPosts are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable fans.
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Would they actually pass on Suh
I think the Lions and Rams might be the only 2 teams in the NFL that would be dumb enough to pass on Suh..If hes there at 2 teams will be lined up.
We passed on Aaron Curry last year--the defense player the majority of fans wanted
Quarterback is the most important position in football. I think the belief is true that if a team does not have a franchise QB, they need to get one in order to be competitive in the NFL, and the vast majority of second- and third-round quarterbacks bust.
Also, since we know that any draft pick can bust, Quarterback is actually a slightly safer pick than Defensive Tackle, in the top half of the first round (here is the research from Walter Football)
Maybe they go with the safer pick—the quarterback, which is also the most important position in football, and take Bradford or Clausen over Suh. I don’t think it’s a “dumb” decision.
Or, maybe they pick Suh. I don’t think either decision is bad for them.
Hey that's a timeout, I can play right? yeah, get me--get the F-- Help me up...I can throw the ball if you need me to throw the ball...
Y'all don't understand
The Rams will select a QB 1st overall for the same reasons that the Lions selected Stafford 1st overall last year; Money. No team will want to lock up $40+ mil guaranteed and $12 mil / year on a position other than QB or LT. Essentially, when drafting at the top of the draft, the BPA doesn’t usually get taken unless said player is a QB or LT.
So, per your post, it will benefit the Lions the most if the Rams goof and select anyone other than Bradford or Clausen. The only position worthy of trading up for is that of a potential franchise QB. I will be shocked if any team trades up to select Suh, McCoy or Berry because it will require a financial commitment leaps and bounds higher than that of any DT or DB in the NFL.
Well... yes and no
They will take Bradford because of both money AND overall impact. A franchise quarterback (which is what you assume you are drafting at #1 overall) should always be the target when you don’t have one… especially at #1. If you don’t have one… you try each and every year until you get one. This was why I championed so hard for Stafford last year. And that’s the crux of the Ram’s situation… they don’t have one. How can they pass on Bradford for yet another DL – yes, even Suh – when they have no one to play QB and no prospects in the bullpen? They have no choice really… they’ll take Bradford.
+1
I should’ve elaborated more on my post that you responded to. I agree with you 100%.
There’s one caveat, however. Say that Clausen and Bradford, who both have the potential to be franchise QBs, are not in this draft, and say that Tim Tebow and Dan Lefevour are the top QBs (using scout.com’s rankings). If that was the scenario, then I could not support a decision to select one of those QBs 1st overall because the the gap in talent between Suh/McCoy/Okung and Tebow/Lefevour is so large. In this scenario, the Rams would have to take Suh.
Well, right...
the value of the player still has to match the cost of the pick. If you’re the Rams and Tebow and LeFevour are your best options… QB hasn’t even entered the equation. You made up your mind two months ago that you were taking Suh. Done deal.
However.....
I think that Dan LeFevour can be a franchise QB……he is pretty damn good.
Oh you didn't know?? You're ass better CALLLLLLLL SOMEBODY!!!!!
I agree
He looked pretty good as he was beating Michigan State! Zing!
But anyhow, yes, he’s one of those quarterback prospects I really don’t want to underestimate.
agree
How good is a D-Lineman when your offense can’t move?
Sure, you’ll get more run-stuffs & sacks for the highlight reel, but you’re losing games 20-6
Hey that's a timeout, I can play right? yeah, get me--get the F-- Help me up...I can throw the ball if you need me to throw the ball...
I call Imposter!
This can’t be the same Ralph. He is speaking in complete sentences and using punctuation! And he is making sense with accurate and insightful commentary!
Whoa re you and what have you done with Ralph!
hahaha ˆˆˆˆ
K.I.S.S.-Keep It Simple Stupid
by Waitingfortheroar on Mar 3, 2010 12:11 PM EST up reply actions
lmao as well
Remember that knowledge is power and If my recollect serves me right he was in school last year…
I agree ATL.....doesn't seem like the same guy
Oh you didn't know?? You're ass better CALLLLLLLL SOMEBODY!!!!!
Becasue Mccoy
is a great player….everyone is making a bid deal about his combine….WHO CARES ITS JUST THE COMBINE…..he will be a great player.
by BennieBladesFan on Mar 3, 2010 10:57 AM EST up reply actions
people say Suh had the better combine ?
McCoy ran faster , did cones better ,Suh did more reps ,and jumped higher . McCoy just gets deeper into the back field more often.Suh had more sacks,its because QBS rolled out EVERY snap vs McCoy,watch the Texas,Texas Tech and Florida games vs Sooners,they rolled out EVERY passing play.
Suh did 32 reps at 225 McCoy 23 reps at 225 McCoy has done as many as 40 reps according to his streghth coach..he did his lifts 15 mins after he ran 3 -40 yd dashes(once was a -redo) and Suh did his lifting 2 hours after his running
Both will be GREAT NFL players and the Lions biggest “need” is DT so its a no-brainer
they pretty much ran the exact same 40
and upper body strength is only have of what you use when your a down lineman. However, it is still pretty important. 9 reps is alot. and it shows you have good quick twitch, and endurance muscle. I was really impressed with Suh.
by Waitingfortheroar on Mar 3, 2010 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
Not saying that you guys are wrong
especially cause I don’t have the NFL network to watch it myself, but everything I’ve herd said that Suh lifted more ran faster and was more fluid in all the drills than McCoy and that Suh seperated himself ways away from McCoy. But again I didn’t get to see it just what was on ESPN. And First take!
im in davis'
boat. but, I heard Suh pretty much stood out in comparrison to Mccoy
K.I.S.S.-Keep It Simple Stupid
by Waitingfortheroar on Mar 3, 2010 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
There was no comparison.....
Suh stood out in comparison to McCoy…….
Maybe this is the real Ralph…..where is your link Ralph?
Oh you didn't know?? You're ass better CALLLLLLLL SOMEBODY!!!!!
haha me?
lol you can compare them they ran the same drills!!!!
K.I.S.S.-Keep It Simple Stupid
by Waitingfortheroar on Mar 3, 2010 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
This is what I meant
McCoy ran faster , did cones better
I saw different, on the NFL Network……
Now, prove me wrong…..and provide a link to the proof.
Oh you didn't know?? You're ass better CALLLLLLLL SOMEBODY!!!!!
I would say McCoy
Aparently the likelyhood that they draft McCoy is there, and if that happens, then we’re sitting on a gold mine of a pick at 2.
The beginning of the end of the misery
Exactly....
….ill take either one but if the Rams take Suh i think we can trade down and pick up extra picks as well….But id be tickled with Mccoy as well
by BennieBladesFan on Mar 3, 2010 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
i do hope
that the rams go out and get bradford or clausen… we than can draft suh or even trade down with someone else who is in desperate need for a qb. This way we can still get a playmaker in the top 10 with extra picks. either way if the rams take a qb its a win win for us.
+1
Cause if the rams do take either QB, then someone will have to jump in front of Washington at the 4 pick to get the other QB, TB would love us cause they would get 1 of the 2 DT’s that they need, So If no one offers a trade then the top 4 teams will get pieces that they all need.Rams get Bradford; Lions get Suh TB gets McCoy and then Washington gets their Diva QB, just like their coach had when he was in Denver.Man we are so lucky that the Lions didn’t make that trade with Denver for the cry baby last year.It looks like he has already drivin outta town his best TE.
Suh
will never make it to tampa. I really belive dat
The best there is, The best there was, and the best there ever will be - Bret the Hitman hart
I voted for either QB, so teams will move up for the other QB.
But I do not want Detroit to trade below the # 6 spot [Seattle] to ensure that we get a real impact player. ie. one of Suh, McCoy, Berry or Okung.
It would have to be a huge trade to go below the spot to grab one of those guys. IMO.
Let’s face it guys, the chances of us trading down are extremely small. It would be nice if Seattle, Tampa, or Washington traded up with us but that is mostly a dream.
I'm with North
The Bringers of Hope: Stafford - Delmas - C. Johnson - Pettigrew - Levy - Hill - Schwartz
Zack Follett: he will hurt your mind.
by Hyperion Ecta on Mar 3, 2010 6:04 PM EST up reply actions
Quarterback will be the only reason the #2...
pick will be valued. WHEN Bradford goes #1 to the Rams, only Clausen being very, very highly valued will possibly lead to a trade. Teams just won’t give up that much to get a DT… even a great one like Suh.
Like I’ve said… Detroit will be content to stay put and take Suh… what a horrid consolation prize…. :o)
the thing is everyone knows us an tampa wont take QB so why trade up that far for jimmy
The best there is, The best there was, and the best there ever will be - Bret the Hitman hart
Well... that's the real problem, isn't it?
That’s why I don’t think it will happen. But… the reason would be to leapfrog Washington. If someone traded up to #3 to get Clausen, another team could still trade with us to leapfrog that team. So why would you even mess with TB? Detroit is in the best situation to receive a trade to get past Washington. So it’s still possible, just not overly plausible. Again, Clausen has to have one helluva pro day and had to really impress teams in his combine interviews. Like I said… possible, just not probable.
Exactly......couldn't have said it better myself....:o)
Oh you didn't know?? You're ass better CALLLLLLLL SOMEBODY!!!!!
Doesn't make sense
That doesn’t make any sense. no one will trade up with tampa before tampa is on the clock. if someone is willing to trade what it takes to get the #2 pick, they will trade with tampa first because they are willing to give up more and tampa doesn’t want a QB with #3. Why trade to #2 when you could give less at #3 and get the same thing?
Good point
However, what if they think that Tampa will not trade and WE are on the clock? Maybe Bradford went #1 and we can get Suh at 2…..and a team figures Tampa will just take McCoy at 3, which would allow Washington to take Clausen at pick 4?? Everyone knows (at least it is a good assumption) that Tampa Bay wants a DT. So it makes more sense to approach Detroit before Tampa Bay is on the clock……for example, if Detroit were to take Berry or Okung at pick 2 instead of Suh, Tampa Bay may be hard pressed to trade down when they have Suh (the guy they most likely covet) available.
Oh you didn't know?? You're ass better CALLLLLLLL SOMEBODY!!!!!
Ummm... what?
Actually what you said doesn’t really make sense. Why would you risk waiting to see what happens with Detroit just to wait to trade with Tampa Bay? If you traded with Tampa before they are on the clock, another team could simply leapfrog you and trade with Detroit. If you wait until Detroit selects and Tampa is on the clock, another team could move ahead of you by trading with Detroit while they are on the clock. That makes no sense not to completely secure the player you want if you are giving up a bunch of picks to get Clausen. Right?
For example… Cleveland REALLY wants Clausen. STL just drafted Bradford at #1. If I’m Cleveland and I’ve already made up my mind that I am going to give up whatever is needed to get Clausen, why would I wait for Tampa to get on the clock and allow another team… say WAS, SEA, etc to jump up to #2 ahead of me? That makes no sense. If I’m CLE, I will jump up to a spot where no one else can beat me to Clausen. Make sense?
Makes perfect sense to me
I think his hang up was on the idea of trading with TAMPA before they were on the clock……when the point was that trading with the LIONS when they are on the clock makes more sense.
Oh you didn't know?? You're ass better CALLLLLLLL SOMEBODY!!!!!
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