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I can't stand this any longer

All of this talk about Kevin Smith is killing me.  You hate the guy after one poor preseason showing.  Per how angry I am about all of this talk that we should cut him, I will just put down my reasons why everyone who wants to cut/trade him away is obviously smoking some nasty stuff.


Star-divide

1. He is a back-up, guys.  Best is obviously our number 1 runner.  He is a solid back-up runner despite you guys saying he could get tackled by a gust of wind.  Give it up.

2. He is coming off an injury.  A big one at that.  You try tearing your ACL in week 14 and come back to full strength today.  Good luck.

3. What if Best gets injured, God forbid?  You really want Mo Mo as our number 1 runner?  I'd rather have Smith over Mo any day of the week.  As for Aaron Brown, I liked what he did today; against the Browns secondary defense.  Smith is playing against starters.  Granted, he hasn't looked like the promising guy we saw in his rookie year, but we don't have to worry about that.

4.  This is his 3rd year!  People are acting like he was our first round draft pick 6 years ago and he hasn't put up any numbers what so ever.  He is still learning. 

5.  He still has more upside than Mo Mo.  He performs arguable as good as him when he is healthy, and still has a ways to go to reach his potential.  He understands the offense better than Brown does too.

 

So prove 'em wrong K-smoove.  I would love to see you put up 800+ yards this year as a back-up. 

 

For the comments, that I am sure to get blasted at, I am not in love with Smith.  I love Best.  I'm not trying to give Smith a starting job.  So don't try to pull that on me. 

Blast away.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Pride of Detroit or its writers. FanPosts are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable fans.

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Morris has a considerably better career Y/Carry than Smith.

So, infact, does Aaron Brown for that matter.
So, infact, does DeDe Dorsey.

Smith is completely unremarkable as a running back. That isn’t an insult, or even a bad thing. But he’s definitely completely unremarkable.

by Trysdor on Aug 28, 2010 8:58 PM EDT reply actions  

+1

Lions fans deserve better than being the laughing stock of the NFL. Lets all hope they are heading in the right direction finally.

by joshsun on Aug 28, 2010 8:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

None of the other guys was ever a feature back

Its one thing to come in with fresh legs in the 4th and knock out a 10 yard run when tehy are thinking pass. Its another to be a feature back and be the guy they are all looking at.

That said, he never had that ability to make a guy miss or to break a tackle. 3 yards and a cloud of dust.

Best is obviously our #1

by ATL Lion on Aug 28, 2010 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

THANK YOU (the followin is a rant in my head read at your own risk I am venting)

This anti-kev crap is pissing me off. Sounds like people just need someone to blame watch the game. One fumble but for the most part the down hill runner was converting downs with 4 to 5 yard runs. Blocking well thats what kevin does. He’s never gonna be Maurice Jones drew but he has a job in the offense and ya know what. He is prett damn good at it. I wanted to make a post but I figure I’d come off like a dick so I will just do that in a reply LOL. Fact is Kevin works hard he shows up every day and does his job. Best was drafted to be the play making runnung back. If you hate on kevin for what he does than I personally feel you don’t under stand what his job is. We had morris as are #1 for a brief time last year and he was far from impressive as well. Then again I understand some people will hate for the sake of hating. Zack Follet, Derrik Williams, Kevin Smith, Jason Hansen, Gosder Cherilus there all targets. No player is perfect but when the know there role and do it well then they are a good player. Kevin will never be extravagent…Solid yes and thats all you can ask for….

Suh,Williams,Avril,VandenBosch
With the Four Horsemen ride,Or choose your fate and die

by The Profiler on Aug 28, 2010 9:04 PM EDT reply actions  

+1 Hells yea prof, preach it brother.

"I’d probably get arrested because football’s my only time I get to go out there and hit people as hard as I can, and it’s legal," Follett said. "I need that once a year."

by Rick Chaffee on Aug 28, 2010 9:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, you're right...

The Lions should ‘wait’ for him to recover.

by CLF on Aug 29, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm glad it was you and not me making that point bro.

Cause for the past 2 years he was getting smacked as he was getting the ball from the QB, because the O-line was so crappy, then he plays hurt for most of the year and these guys all seem to want 2000 yards.

How many lumps you want Doc?

by davis0169 on Aug 31, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Smith is fine!

He’s our best pass protection HB and can be used in different situations in the receiving game. good runner, just wont break the long runs. Smith is a good back up running back.

by AndrewE on Aug 28, 2010 9:07 PM EDT reply actions  

I will admit tho...

wen smith fumbles it always hurts the lions bad. For example last year against the vikings when we had the lead, that turned things around. With that I will say he doesnt fumble often.

by AndrewE on Aug 28, 2010 9:09 PM EDT reply actions  

YES! THANK YOU ALSO!!

I was gonna write a post just like this, same points as yours too! Totally agree! Saved me some time!

by Lionsfan8 on Aug 28, 2010 9:18 PM EDT reply actions  

Ok so he's a blocking back, I get it...

If he’s a blocking back then why do they constantly hand the ball off to him? I’ll say it again, last year he was a big part of the reason we went 3 and out every single damn series, he can’t manage to pickup 10 on 3 carries then he’s useless..If he’s such a good blocking back like you guys say then he needs to be in on just pass plays and block! I don’t know what you guys are smoking, but Smith equals 3 and out so stop pleasuring his penis! I’ll say another thing twice, today aaron brown ripped the browns apart, yes it was against the brown second or third string Defense, I understant, now if smith would have taken those same snaps against that same defense he wouldn’t have even came close to producing the numbers that brown did. I say cut him, Im a beloved Lions fan and I’m tired of other fans settling and accepting such unproductive players like Kevin Smith. He was good in college and I don’t question his work ethic or heart, but this level is just not for him when it comes to running the ball, if he’s blocking then fine let him block but don’t give the man the ball.

by LionsAreMySpouse on Aug 28, 2010 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ugh.

Smith would have torn apart the Brown’s 3rd string defense. You are on crack if you don’t think so. He had over 800 yds his rookie year against 1st stringers, so don’t tell me that you know he wouldn’t have gone above and beyond what Brown did.

I had an ant farm once, but them fellas didn't grow shit

by Bighaircut on Aug 29, 2010 2:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

ya he had 700 last year in 13 games

mo mo had like 370 in 3 games with a 64 yd TD. K smith longest was 32 for no TD

by Gyorick on Aug 29, 2010 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

KEVIN SMITH IS THE NUMBER 2!!!

If he is cut id be shocked. No way he gets cut. NO WAY!!!! Dorsey will be gone way before Smith.

by BennieBladesFan on Aug 28, 2010 9:37 PM EDT reply actions  

I agree that he wont probably wont be cut

but people became to connected… He has only gave asinine predictions and talked alot of game but nothing ever really came of it. Hes not a change of pace back.

by Gyorick on Aug 29, 2010 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was a KSmooth lover...

but after two years of watch him get tripped up by arm tackles when running through an open hole is so irritating. Do you ever notice he seems to always be falling forward? Sometimes I think he looks like a kid running around the yard pretending to fly like superman, ya know hunched over with their backs parallel to the ground, arms spread wide.

  I’m not totally hating either, he is a good back up, but I am surprised about all the love he is getting along with a bunch “he just came off injury” excuses. The Kevin I saw today is the same Kevin I saw in every other game he played. What has he done for you lately ever? He is not the future, he is depth, and based on the high hopes I had for him, he is a bust. Kevin Smith will never be more than what he has been, a servicable number 2 running back. Or trade bait for someone who can actually cover somebody.

by wmuhaplo on Aug 28, 2010 10:00 PM EDT reply actions  

You hate the guy after one poor preseason showing

no i hate the guy for 2 years of poor showing

by det32 on Aug 28, 2010 10:19 PM EDT reply actions  

WOW

because the guy who’s your profile pic, Ernie Fuckin’ Sims, did SO much for us in his four years in Detroit, right?

I’ve never had any issue with you besides your horrible grammar det32, but right now you sound, what’s the word I’m looking for… dumb. Yeah, that’s it, dumb.

You say we should get rid of him. Give me ONE legitimately good reason we should get rid of him. Don’t worry, I’ll wait, I’ve got time.

What’s that? You’ve got nothing? That’s crazy, because as zealous as you are about getting rid of K-Smith I would think you actually could come up with a single good reason why it might make sense to get rid of him.

It’s not like Best is injury prone, or Mo Morris is turning 31 this season or anything. And it’s definitely not like Felton, who only weighs a mere 250 pounds, can’t be a productive every down back. I mean, fuck it, who needs a RB that is capable of doing anything besides run in a straight line, right? And Aaron Brown and DeDe Dorsey have proven time and time again that they are infinitely superior backs, right? Right? Isn’t that right, det32?

by motown313 on Aug 29, 2010 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

well he doesn’t have good vision
he cant brake a tackle to save his life
isn’t as fast as the other backs we have (best brown dede) is about same as Morris
he is a millen pick
he hasn’t had that spunk the rest of the O has had you listen to him talk and it doesn’t sound like he believe what he is saying
he has been a disappointment so far in his career.. and RB usly come out there shell early

he just isnt a suitble number 2 RB.. i would take him as a reciver but at a RB no thanks

by det32 on Aug 29, 2010 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't agree with the top 2

Smith does have good vision and can break tackles. I’ve seen him turn a 4 yard loss into a 4 yd gain via a couple of broken tackles and spottin the hole. I’m not saying he’s perfect or anything, but vision is a strength of his.

RIP Robyn Bailey 1961 - 2010. I love you mum.

by Hyperion Ecta on Aug 29, 2010 6:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Det32 is completely correct

Smith is fake, he is a petender, he has lost alot in 3 years, cut em Dano. Aaron Brown has upside if he can get to function in the offence. DE DE Brown is to much like the other small backs Detroit already has. The Lions could use a big tackle breaking, punising style back, a bruser, for late in the game and ball controll and short yardage and to run out the clock in those siuations.

by sonofalion on Aug 29, 2010 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I must be watching a different LIONS team.

Because K-Smooth has NEVER had a hole to run threw in the 2 years he was the starter, yes he did get tackled a little too eazy last year but he was also trying to play threw injury, while getting smacked as he recieved the ball from Staff, because let’s face it a rookie QB with 1 WR is going to scare the living shit out of the other teams D. Oh yeah like the 8 and 9 they were stacking in the box against us last year. Yeah you guys that all want Smith cut have to think about how many times he didn’t get more than 20 carries a game because we were so far behind after the first series that we could stick to the running game. And now that Smith has came back from a 2 year injury in roughly 6 months you are all going to want 1000+ yards as a #2 to Best as well. Next year is the year that Smith will be totally healthy from the ACL tear not this year and he just has too much up-side to let go.

How many lumps you want Doc?

by davis0169 on Aug 31, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's fake? A pretender?

What does that even mean in regards to an NFL player? I don’t know who you are, or where you came from, but you sound pretty damn ignorant to me.

by motown313 on Aug 31, 2010 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

also one injure is fr from injure prone

ever time felton touches the ball something good happens

and more the run in a straight line?? are you trying to say smith is good at cuts?? are you kidding me

by det32 on Aug 29, 2010 12:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

smithe ran for 747 yards a 3.4 avg
morries ran for 384 yards a 4.1 avg
brown ran for 131yards a 4.9 avg
dede (2007) ran for 183 yards a 8.7 avg

you relly have a 3.4 avg??

by det32 on Aug 29, 2010 12:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ahhh

Feature back vs situational.

Seeing a fresh 1st team D for 2 quarters will lower your avg significantly.

by ATL Lion on Aug 30, 2010 7:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

NO way ATL

That can’t possibly be true just look at the stats that det32 put up there. It’s obvious that we have to get rid of Smith…….. :-( DET32 you must not be thinking straight today.

How many lumps you want Doc?

by davis0169 on Aug 31, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Backup

NEVER RELEASE OR TRADE DEPTH ON A TEAM THAT HAS NO DEPTH!

WHHHHHYYYYYY?

If you are pondering, "What am I supposed to do" think the EXACT OPPOSITE thing as Matt Millen is thinking.

by LionsGuy4Ever on Aug 28, 2010 10:23 PM EDT reply actions  

there is probably at least 28 teams

that would lave if we got rid of K Smooth. Without a doubt the stupidest subject we have had on the POD. You dont get rid of valuable depth at running back.

if the shoe fits...get another one just like it - George Carlin

by JCruize on Aug 28, 2010 11:03 PM EDT reply actions   2 recs

+ 1,000,000

If you are pondering, "What am I supposed to do" think the EXACT OPPOSITE thing as Matt Millen is thinking.

by LionsGuy4Ever on Aug 28, 2010 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

The dumbest discussion on the POD? I doubt it. But damn close.

KSmith is not going anywhere. He will be an important part of this team’s success. The Lions look like they have turned potentially the weakest position on the team into a solid and deep one. With Best, Smith, Morris, Felton, and Brown we have five backs who can all run and catch. Smith and Morris can block well enough, and from what I am hearing Best has surprised the coaches with how well he is picking it up. Felton needs to get better in that part of the game.

JC, I would call this the most pointless discussion we have had this training camp. Although any thread about Stanton comes a close second.

by NorthLeft12 on Aug 29, 2010 7:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

I dont get it

He is now our #2 back. Why all the fuss over him? He was put in a shitty position his rookie year and did well. He was starting to flash some skills in his second year—longer runs, some moves to make guys miss—and he blew out his knee. Now he is going to see the bench in favor of Best and people are saying he is terrible?

by ATL Lion on Aug 28, 2010 11:12 PM EDT reply actions  

Are you talking about the Lions runningbacks???

if the shoe fits...get another one just like it - George Carlin

by JCruize on Aug 28, 2010 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I hope he's not

because that just wouldn’t sound very intelligent.

by motown313 on Aug 28, 2010 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think he is talking about his fantasy football team

if the shoe fits...get another one just like it - George Carlin

by JCruize on Aug 28, 2010 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because..

747 yrds rushing combine with 415 yrds receiving is better than 384 and 210 yrds. If Morris was better. Morris would have been the starter last season. Maybe you should ask Schwartz. Word of warning when you ask. Take a step back before Schwartz slaps you up side the head.

if the shoe fits...get another one just like it - George Carlin

by JCruize on Aug 29, 2010 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

you got to be kiding me

when smith went down and Morris went in what where your thoughts

“god dam where fucked now b/c smith is gone”
or
“Morris is looking really good)

by det32 on Aug 29, 2010 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

My thoughts were Fuck where is Smith...

when Morris post a 18 car for 37 yards in his start against SF

if the shoe fits...get another one just like it - George Carlin

by JCruize on Aug 29, 2010 12:50 AM EDT up reply actions  

o yea i forgot that smithe

8 for 20 tonught was so good
or his
3 for 6 last wekk

by det32 on Aug 29, 2010 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

tonight
felton 6 for 37
brown 5 for 35
best 1 for 51

yea smithe is better then all of them no questen

by det32 on Aug 29, 2010 12:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

You need to know

The lions coaches think Smith is currently #2 … not 3. 4 or 5

And I trust them .. then know what was asked of smith, his conditioning and what to expect in the future ..

As pointed out, why trade depth, He IS better than everyone except best .. and IF the lions trade him, I won’t bitch .. they are doing a good job .. let them ..

by Libran on Aug 29, 2010 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe we should start a thread that says:
“Lets trade away another valuable asset on our team for a 5th rounder watching them get 30 touches a game on the Bears and racking up a 1000 yard season-And if that is not good enough lets just release Morris too because we obviously are anti-depth”

Too long of a title?

If you are pondering, "What am I supposed to do" think the EXACT OPPOSITE thing as Matt Millen is thinking.

by LionsGuy4Ever on Aug 28, 2010 11:21 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Wayyyy too long.

You should be released from P.O.D because you had one bad title that was too long. You suck. I hate you. We’re trading you for a 2nd grader.

I had an ant farm once, but them fellas didn't grow shit

by Bighaircut on Aug 29, 2010 2:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Mike Valenti on 97.1 is right

Detroit sports fans are the biggest excuse making suckers in the country.
Sports is a cutthroat biz and roster turnover is a given but we want to hang on to every player because they showed a little 2 years before.

If there’s some one better cut him.
I have KS 4th down.

by delusional on Aug 28, 2010 11:47 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Valenti is a moron

he knows a lil about hoops and baseball, but is clueless with the NFL or NHL. Just because he’s good at fantasy football and does well with Vegas odds, he thinks he knows all. I’ve heard him hang-up on countless callers who provide a valid counterpoint and then bash them. He used to be funny, but his schtick is old and dated. I like Terry Foster and Matt Darey, but I gotta change the station at 2:00.
Kevin Smith is a 3rd down back like Chester Taylor or Kevin Faulk. He’s great at blitz pick-up, has good hands receiving and can get the tough 3-4 yards. I’m not a big Smith fan, but he brings alot of value to the team as a 3rd down back, which is now his role.

In life, a man is either the hammer or the anvil. Ndamukong Suh is both
Pride of Detroits village idiot

by JazzyBBP on Aug 29, 2010 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Valenti is the biggest dope on Detroit radio outside of Sean Hannity.

Valenti would have, and did, pick Andre Smith instead of Staff and still won’t admit he was wrong.

What a maroon.

by NorthLeft12 on Aug 29, 2010 7:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ok in another thread I posted this so I will reiterate it here and maybe expand on it some.

Here is my depth chart and I will explain why below. Best, Felton, Brown, Smith, Morris, Dorsey.

Best: He is a play maker, someone capable of rushing for 2,000 yards some year, or at least getting 2,000 all purpose yards. No one else on this roster has those capabilities IMO. He is electric and hands down a threat any time he touches the ball. He also excells at all portions of the game, not just running but also in receiving and pass protect too.

Felton: This guy is a beast power back and I think the combination of him and Best has just cost Kevin Smith his roster spot. This guy flat out drags guys for 5 yards at times and he is just as good as Smith in passing game and even better in pass protect.

Brown: Though he has had ups and downs he shows promise and occasionally flashes us with a big gain. There is no doubt that he can perform in all aspect of the game except pass protect. He still needs work here but almost every rookie running back struggles with bass protection. I am also pleasantly surprised at his ability to run between the tackles and near the goal line this year.

Smith: Well as unpopular as it might seem it is his time to go, trade him while he still has some value. Some teams like the Texans, Titans, and Chargers are hurting bad for a solid depth guy and we should be able to get a 5th round pick for him if nothing else. Hell even the Patriots might be interested in him. The only weakness I see in his game is lack of enough speed to be an explosion back and lack of enough power to carry tacklers. he is always falling forward and that is a sign of a good running back but I see him as just a 3 yards and pile of dust kind of guy. Solid but nothing special. lets face it this guy was a 3rd round pick (64th overall) and he has performed about up to those levels of a 3rd round pick from the Millen / Marinelli era. I like Kevin on a personal level because he is a hard worker and a stand up kind of guy. I am all right with him making the roster as a 4th running back but I am not sure that the front office wants to pay his kind of money for a situational insurance policy type of running back.

Morris: Though I like Mo I put him about equal to Smith. At his age he is on the decline of his career and he has no power to his game, I also am not a fan of his pass protection. He gets bigger gains on runs than Smith and I think he is a better pure running back, but I do not think he is as rounded in the other parts of his game. Also Smith still has some upside while Morris is clearly on the downhill slide.

Dorsey: Dede is the first one cut IMO. He is a one trick pony in my book and just does not offer enough to take a spot from above mentioned players. He cannot pass protect and has no power to his game either. On top of that I don’t think he is as polished in teh passing game as most of the other backs either. He is not the kind of guy you can line up in the slot like Best or Brown.

To recap, we keep Best and Brown as our big hitter types, speed guys that can basically turn into slot receivers with a formation shift. Keep Felton and Smith for power backs with Felton being the starter and seeing the majority of the snaps until he loses the job or Kevin takes it away from him. Cut Morris and Dorsey, I don’t think anyone would trade for them. One Caveat is that if we can trade Smith we could keep Nordin on the roster. He offers some nice options to be a FB, TE, H-back, or even go into the slot like Best and Brown do. Honestly if we can get a 5th round or better for Kevin Smith I am all for trading him. And yes for the record I was not happy with him before he was injured, before preseason, all the way back to last year.

by Evilsmurf on Aug 29, 2010 1:30 AM EDT reply actions  

This will be one reply where I will not be sarcastic

I respect you Evilsmurf, I have seen discussions where you have been right about everything you have posted and I agreed with everything you said. But on this one, I will have to respectfully disagree with you. (But thank you for respectfully disagreeing with me)

Starting with you top players on the depth chart;
Best: I think it’s obvious that he is our number 1. He is a potential Chris Johnson type runner. Speed, enough power, elusiveness, vision ect… he has it all.

Felton: I like him, a lot. But we need him as a full back. He is a beast of a man, and opens up holes for best to run through. We need him to be that player. He is more powerful than Smith, yes, but not as fast or as good as a runner period.

Brown: This is where I had trouble even reading the rest of your post, although I did. Brown has done nothing to support this call as our 3rd RB. He is fast and sometimes elusive, but makes terrible plays that negate our yardage and/or positioning too much. He is a home run threat, but only every once in a few games.

Smith: I’ve already said everything I needed to in my post, so I will not reiterate this.

Morris: He’s way past his prime, which wasn’t very good anyway, and is suitable for situational 3rd down plays and that’s it. Smith has a huge upside advantage.

Dorsey: He’s not making the cut. I like the player, but he’s just not as good as either of the backs above.

But thank you for being a reasonable voice in this conversation, unlike many others, including myself, have been.

I had an ant farm once, but them fellas didn't grow shit

by Bighaircut on Aug 29, 2010 2:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

Its all good, we all have opinions and butts and we are all bound to fall on opposite sides of the fence sooner or later.

I never ever hold anything football related against anyone, personal attacks though I will never respect and its sad to see that happening here on the PoD. I have been here a while now, since pre-draft and I don’t see too many people just going off like that. Hell I am not even the one throwing out slurs and I feel ashamed for the PoD. Don’t let the guy slamming you get to yah, all the real PoDers are not like this and its only a matter fo time before Sean bans him.

by Evilsmurf on Aug 29, 2010 3:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Thank you

See, I can respectfully agree to disagree with you. It’s people like him that just dumbfound me as to how….how should I put this….argue disrespectfully for no reason. It’s just that I can’t not reply to some of his comments that have no merit or helpfulness to this situation.
   I can see your points for Felton and Brown, but I still like Smith as my number two. I just like his upside and the fact that he may not be fully recovered from his injury just yet. I say give him this year and next to see if he can still be valuable.

I had an ant farm once, but them fellas didn't grow shit

by Bighaircut on Aug 29, 2010 3:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

RB – Best, Brown, DeDe
FB Felton

Best- shouldn’t have to explain why we should keep him… but he is 10x better a pass protection then he was advertised

brown- why he isn’t as strong as best.. he is very solid and almost never has negative plays.. teams will need to respect his speed more then they would need to smiths.. brown is a solid runner solid receiver.. he is a sick ST guy.. once again something smith a Morris are not..(brown needs to improve on pass protection)

DeDe – about the same as brown only DeDe is alot faster he also needs needs to improve on pass protection.. he is a sick ST guy.. once again something smith a Morris are not

felton – every time he touches the ball something good happens.. with out question the 2nd best back we have he can do it all…

smith- he has been a disappointment so far.. avenging less then 4 yards.. he can never brake a tackle… yes he falls forward but he falls so god dam much every time he goes throw the gut. if we where to keep 4 RB + 1 FB (witch i think is possible) i wouldn’t mind keeping him just b/c he his younger then Morris… something a few of you have brought up is what he did his rookie year (witch still wasn’t outstanding… ok for a 3rd rounder but not good) but something JS has been very clear on.. it dosent matter what you did in that past but what you are doing right now.. and can you honstly say simith has been the 2nd best back so for in the preseasen?? with his 2 yard avg??
morries- i think with out questen he is better then smith.. but he is geting older

by det32 on Aug 29, 2010 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry, but you're missing points

People, seriously, just because Best had a few good preseason games doesn’t make him Barry Sanders. He still has injury issues, which means that we need to keep our backs around. Felton has the potential to be a great power back, but he is a big work in progress. How many carries has he gotten this preseason? There is no information out there to indicate that Felton is the number two back behind Best.

The thing is, Best is going to be a ton of touches in this offense, whether it is running the ball or catching it. If he goes down, then there is only one other player on this roster that can sufficiently replace those touches. I agree, K Smith’s speed is mediocre, but he does everything else better than Best. MoMo is old, and really that 4.1 YPC last year is a fluke. Remeber, he had a 64 yard run. Take that away, and his YPC drops to 3.4, which is the same a K Smith.

Also, the notion that Morris is somehow faster than Smith is a complete myth. Maurice Morris has around a 4.59 40 time, which I’m guessing was recorded in 2002, when he was drafted. Kevin Smith on the other hand has a 40 time of 4.45, which is much faster.

The beginning of the end of the misery

by Latif Masud on Aug 29, 2010 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Like I mentioned above

There is a perception that K Smith lacks speed which is why he doesn’t break long runs. Thats not true. Breaking long runs is as much about luck as it is about skills. Its far more important to be an all around back that knows how to play the game, then being able to break a 40+ yard run once or twice a season.

The beginning of the end of the misery

by Latif Masud on Aug 29, 2010 7:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry, have to disagree with you there.

Breaking long runs is a skill, not luck. Look at the running backs who had a lot of long runs in the NFL. They are fast, shifty, have great acceleration, balance, and vision.

Slower backs don’t break as many long runs. Kevin Smith is in the slower back category. Jahvid Best is in the fast back group. I don’t see how you can argue with that.

Kevin is still a valuable player for the Lions. We need a committee. We don’t need to depend on one guy.

by NorthLeft12 on Aug 29, 2010 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

I gotta disagree with your disagreement

Have there been certain backs that regularly broke long runs? Yup, there still is: Chris Johnson, but on average long runs happen because of defensive mistakes, not a runningback’s talents.

The beginning of the end of the misery

by Latif Masud on Aug 29, 2010 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well thank you.

I don’t like getting into arguments that are not about OUR team, the Lions, but I can’t help myself sometimes.
Yes, it was right after your comment, but I was seriously directing it at the guy above you, because he was being sarcastic and so was I. What I said was taken out of context.

Now, we can get back to debating about K-Smoove for the rest of this post.

P.S. : I know you probably don’t value my opinion too much anymore, but if I could say one thing about your posts/comments, it would be that you may be a little over indulgent and harsh with what you say. I read your post about how you hate Smith and such. But as Motown said, you tend to over generalize some things, and that’s why I disagreed with you as much as I did.
No harm no foul. Keep posting, keep debating. ( About the Lions though)

I had an ant farm once, but them fellas didn't grow shit

by Bighaircut on Aug 29, 2010 3:33 AM EDT reply actions  

It's all good.

I’m that way about most sports and players, just not Smith for some reason. I’ve been too passionate about many things before so I know how it is.

And no shit, if you’re half as passionate about anything as your were about Smith than you’ll make some high school players vomit on the practice field.

I had an ant farm once, but them fellas didn't grow shit

by Bighaircut on Aug 29, 2010 3:48 AM EDT reply actions  

I just thought I should put these links up here, to help support the Free Kevin movement, you know so he can find a new home ;)
Are Kevin Smith’s days numbered as a Lion if he’s not good enough to be Jahvid Best’s primary backup at running back?

Smith should be cut. He’s tough and gritty and certainly dedicated in his recovery from major knee surgery last season, but he’s no better than fourth-best running back on the team right now. Maurice Morris is better suited as the No. 2. He has got a little wiggle and he’s a better receiver out of the backfield. But second-year man Aaron Brown is more worthy of being the No. 3 running back because he could also assist special teams and a kick returner.

Coach Jim Schwartz said Saturday was Brown’s most complete game as a running back.

Smith isn’t versatile enough to keep around as a No. 3 back.

If there are any surprise roster cuts coming this week, it wouldn’t surprise if Smith is gone.

Read more: Three Lions questions with Drew Sharp | freep.com | Detroit Free Press http://www.freep.com/article/20100829/SPORTS01/8290672/1049/rss14#ixzz0xzM3JDyY

DECISIONS, DECISIONS: The Lions have a difficult decision to make next week when they trim their roster to 53. Kevin Smith and Maurice Morris are competing for spots as backup running backs, but neither does much on special teams. Aaron Brown isn’t as complete a runner, but he had a nice game Saturday with two touchdowns and a big kick return. Fullback Jerome Felton also got a long look at tailback, rushing six times for 37 yards. If the Lions feel comfortable enough with Felton and Brown as Best’s backups, Smith or Morris might not make the cut.

Read more: Hot topics from the Lions’ exhibition game | freep.com | Detroit Free Press http://www.freep.com/article/20100829/SPORTS01/8290673/1049/rss14#ixzz0xzMJqc9P

by Evilsmurf on Aug 29, 2010 6:15 AM EDT reply actions  

I knew we'd have our big heated debate of the season sometime

First, it was “Should we draft Stafford?”, then it was “Who should start – Culpepper or Stafford”, then to a lesser extent we had “Suh vs everyone else, Draft 2010”, and now we have “Is Kevin Smith valuable?”.

I wonder how long this debate will last for? My prediction is not long since we don’t have one of the major pride members (no offence to fellow pride members LionsAreMySpouse and Bighaircut) or a troll keeping the debate raging.

Now for my opinion, I still think Smith is a serviceable running back. I like his ability to catch out of the backfield, and he can still make the tough yards. Morris hasn’t quite consistently done this for me to choose him over Smith.

RIP Robyn Bailey 1961 - 2010. I love you mum.

by Hyperion Ecta on Aug 29, 2010 6:22 AM EDT reply actions   2 recs

Id rather trade him if it is possible. I dont know though there are so many good RB's out there.

On a side note I was watching the Saints / Chargers game on NFL Network tonight and the Saints announcers were saying that Vonte Davis (I think that is his name, the CB that was on Chicago) might not make the roster. This seems like he would be a good guy to pick up for us if he becomes available. When I was watching the game he had excellent ability to locate the ball in the air and make plays on it, something most of our current CB’s struggle with.

by Evilsmurf on Aug 29, 2010 6:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agree HE.

For those who want to trade KSmith; Mayhew is smart enough not to trade a guy when he is at his lowest value. Kevin will get you nothing in a trade right now.

With a better offensive line [which I think most of us agree that we have right now] KSmith should do much better, and at worst increase his potential value by year end.

by NorthLeft12 on Aug 29, 2010 7:50 AM EDT up reply actions  

Are you looking for me to keep this issue raging, Hyper? Lol....

I’m late to the party, so I’ll not try to extend this thing, but I read through the thread. Most of it is nonsense, but with respect to the core question, a.k.a. is Kevin Smith any good and should he be traded…. respectively, yes and no.

Is Smith a 1,500 yd back? No. I think we can collectively agree to that. Does he have more value than a late round draft choice to the Lions? How can you say no? I mean, c’mon. If he’s healthy, he has immense value to the Lions as a compliment to Best. I don’t really even see where the debate is. Had he not gotten injured last year, I wonder if we would have moved up for Best? I’m sure we would have made a move, but Smith has had enough moments to make people realize he has skills and value. To minimalize those into a “he sucks” or “I hate him” tag is ridiculous and shows lack of intellect.

I would be very, very surprised to see the Lions trade Smith. They will keep four backs on the roster and Smith will be a solid part of every game plan. I wouldn’t have imagined this response after this kid has worked so damn hard to come back from a significant injury and is playing in only his second preseason game since Baltimore. Yeah, he fumbled. Get over it. The kid works hard and has good vision and agility. One more time… he has value.

by DrewsLions on Aug 29, 2010 9:36 AM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

The issue of his production was before his injury...

This is the thing that is causing so much debate. Most people that are defending Smith are using his injury as an excuse for his production. Before he went on IR last year his production was amongst the worst in the league, I don’t know how many 30, 40 and 50 yard games he had last year untill he was injured. He was a huge part in our 3 and outs. People again will say it was because of our O-line, not true again, how about all the screen plays he recieved with an open lane for at least 30 to 40 yards and he tripped over his own feet with nobody within 5 to 10 yards of him or when he didn’t trip over his own feet, it took a simple diving finger to the tip of his cleets for him to be tackled. This is unacceptable for me and should be for most of us. But hey, maybe most of us either like our Lions being horrible, or maybe it’s acceptable here because everyone forgot what a good running back looks like cuz it’s been so long since we’ve had one. All in all we will see what happens, like Evilsmurf said don’t be surprised if he is cut.

by LionsAreMySpouse on Aug 29, 2010 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

#3 on the team in catches and receiving yards

2008 AND 2009. 2009 while sitting three games.

And it’s easy to get 50 yard games when you get less than 20 carries a game.

Not to mention that for as ‘bad’ as he supposedly was last year, he still managed to rush for more yards and a better YPC than LaDanian – which is not bad at all considering the lack of talent on the offensive side of the ball last year.

[...]when Giants coach Steve Owen, a certified defensive genius, was asked how he planned to stop Nagurski, he said: "With a shotgun, as he’s leaving the dressing room."

by NobodySpecial on Aug 29, 2010 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I feel like i started this Yesterday right when he fumbled i jokingly said trade Smith for a CB

but then i realized he has no trade value. lol…he could heal up and become better maybe even good but lets face it he doesnt produce the yards …… no big runs and if we need a heavy power back we have Felton who is a Bad Ass

by perfectlions on Aug 29, 2010 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

I said almost the same thing in the game thread

but I asked if the coaches were putting him out there to showcase him for other teams as trade bait.

Lions fans deserve better than being the laughing stock of the NFL. Lets all hope they are heading in the right direction finally.

by joshsun on Aug 29, 2010 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Smith will benefit when the Lions go to a 2 back set.

 LB’s and Safeties will be leaning toward Best losing step in their reaction time those 2 and 3 yard carries from Smith will become 5 and 6 yard carries. Another play he should pick up a nice chunk of yards would be a fake outside run to Best and a backside screen to Smith. If he has a successful season and his trade value increases I would have no problem if he was moved in the off-season.

by Wayne Fontes on Aug 29, 2010 8:09 AM EDT reply actions  

The "logic" of cutting/trading Smith

is giving me a headache.

Most of these comments gave me a headache. (Thanks Det32)

by FMFDOC8404 on Aug 29, 2010 9:15 AM EDT reply actions  

Unless

We’re talking about a 3 team trade that sends Smith, Heller and a 5th rd pick to whoever wants them for P. Willis and D. Revis. C’mon Hew! Early Xmas.

by FMFDOC8404 on Aug 29, 2010 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

yea there no need for prods like that..

explane why we need to keep smith and his 2 yard avg

by det32 on Aug 29, 2010 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

One thing to consider

Is that I am sure Schwartz and CO thought about this on draft day. They obviously felt Best was the better running back or they wouldn’t have drafted him. It is unfortunate but Kevin got hurt. But, we weren’t having this discussion last year when he was starting, why, because he got the job done with a crappy line. Next week he probably will have a good game and everyone will be back on the train. He is second string. A damn good second string too when healthy. He just isn’t completely back.

Have you ever gotten injured? Seriously injured? It is more than just coming back. it is fighting with a lot of demons especially when it comes to a situation in which is similar to how you got injured. He will be back but it takes time to heal those scars. I remember my friend and I talking about Kevin jones back two years ago, saying if he got hurt again we have to cut him. If Smith goes down again I say do it. But for now we have good depth.

If you are pondering, "What am I supposed to do" think the EXACT OPPOSITE thing as Matt Millen is thinking.

by LionsGuy4Ever on Aug 29, 2010 9:44 AM EDT reply actions  

besides the fumble

Kevin Smith played very well. What the hell is everyone talking about? Catched the ball well, got the 1st downs when we needed them. He was not really seeing the blocking that the other guys were getting on most of his carries. He mostly got what he needed in the situations presented to him.

by x$pcents IV on Aug 29, 2010 10:44 AM EDT reply actions  

Millen Pick

I read one complaint about smith, that one reason to dump him is that he was a millen pick and I thought ’Hell, even a broken clock is right twice a day.
Smith is a grinder, and do remember he was 3rd rounder.
I have also been thinking that he should put on a solid 15-20 pounds of lower body muscle, become a genuine power back, to compliment Best.

And regarding Felton, he has been rusing well, against the Cleveland 3rd string.

by Phreaking Mohican on Aug 29, 2010 11:28 AM EDT reply actions  

this is MORONIC

I have decided I will not read any threads or omments about kevin smith unless sean has posted it as news! this whole discussion has become childish name calling, factless arguments and Anger creating more anger this is far from what the POD is suppose to be about. Hate him I don’t care fact is I don’t care if He is T.O if he is on YOUR team you should rooting for him. everyone needs to step back cool off and re-read there comments again after they do. Its quite insane. The internet is for a free exhange of opinions and ideas the problem is everyone has them.

Suh,Williams,Avril,VandenBosch
With the Four Horsemen ride,Or choose your fate and die

by The Profiler on Aug 29, 2010 11:58 AM EDT reply actions   1 recs

trade smith

for a 6th round pick and move on

by hasselhoff on Aug 29, 2010 12:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Gotta love these intense debates

The last time things got this heated was Stafford vs Culpepper last season, and I must say I am happy to have survived that one.

by Kalzilla on Aug 29, 2010 12:59 PM EDT reply actions  

Yes, I enjoy intense debates too. But do not mistake namecalling and far fetched scenarios as inteligent debate.

Stafford v. Daunte was a debate of philosophy with a heavy dollop of history thrown in. This discussion is not the same. The only data I have seen is KSmith’s last two years of playing real NFL football versus his performance this preseason after coming off a serious knee injury.

by NorthLeft12 on Aug 29, 2010 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I love it when people bust out the crack pipes

They forget how many games our league worst pass defense let get out of control, so that RB touches were limited.

They forget how many times drives stalled not because of Smith, but because one of the lame-o WR’s still on the team without notice dropped balls or failed to run correct routes.

They fail to realize that without Morris’s ONE long run, his per-carry average is 3.5.

Or that Felton’s per carry average is 3.1.

And how Smith was #3 on the team in catches and yards last year, despite missing three games with an injury.

And you guys wanna give up on him? If you guys were GM’s, you would be JP Riccardi.

[...]when Giants coach Steve Owen, a certified defensive genius, was asked how he planned to stop Nagurski, he said: "With a shotgun, as he’s leaving the dressing room."

by NobodySpecial on Aug 29, 2010 6:11 PM EDT reply actions  

Who the hell is JP Riccardi?!?

LINK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J.P.Ricciardi

A Baseball GM? Who the hell follows baseball anyways? Please make references that we can understand without going to Wikipedia.

by NorthLeft12 on Aug 29, 2010 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm sorry you don't know from anything

I don’t try and insult people by immediately comparing them unfavorably with Matt Millen.

[...]when Giants coach Steve Owen, a certified defensive genius, was asked how he planned to stop Nagurski, he said: "With a shotgun, as he’s leaving the dressing room."

by NobodySpecial on Aug 29, 2010 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I can't believe I missed this conversation

Honestly, I can’t believe some of the regulars on here don’t like Smith. He is absolutely perfect for his role. He is a cheap back, who is young, can block and catch, and is a solid enough of a runner that he can fill the void of a feature back whenever he needs to.

I think its a really dumb idea to look at the YPC and decide whether or not he is a good back. Look at Matt Forte’s YPC, its not good either, but he still gets tons of touches in the Chicago offense because of how multi-dimensional he is. Also, we can’t forget that we have had terrible offensive lines the past few years, not to mention a dead passing game that didn’t help out the run.

Best is going to have a great season, but it won’t just be because Jahvid Best is a special talent. It will be because he will line up behind a much improved offensive line, and take handoffs from a quarterback that league is going to fear. No to mention, having a TE in Brandon Pettigrew blocking and receivers like Nate Burleson and Calvin Johnson taking attention away from the running game.

The beginning of the end of the misery

by Latif Masud on Aug 29, 2010 7:02 PM EDT reply actions  

Latif

Thanks, help a brother out.

But don’t use reason…. (whispers- they don’t understand it).

by FMFDOC8404 on Aug 29, 2010 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

So I just watched NFL Network and...

Jamie Dukes and Marshal Faulk predicted the Lions to be the surprise team of the NFC North. Dukes said that the Lions would win 2 divisional games this year. I agree with him too! Both against the Bears :) Faulk went on to say that this is the first season since Barry Left that he has actually seen good players fighting for roster spots on the Lions. He immediately followed that up by jumping into the running back situation here. Now when Marshall Faulk talked about running backs I listen. The three names he mentioned, you guessed it Best, Smith, Brown. He said that Smith has his work cut out for him to earn playing time and both he and Dukes were impressed with Aaron Brown.

After listening to this, and doing a write up where I was thinking about the Eagles and Redskins, which lead me to thinking about McNabb and how much of a mistake that will be for Philly this year I have been forced to rethink some things.

First of all do we want to be viewed like the Eagles fans? A bunch of ungrateful bung holes that run a good player out of town just because of emotion? I know I don’t want to be viewed that way so I had to rethink some things and I am now taking a more cautious approach. I still stick by my guns with Best and Brown, I like both of them over Smith. However I got to thinking about Felton.

Why is he out there on kick offs? Why is he being tried out at tailback? I hardly see him at fullback anymore. Could Felton be the guy that loses his job to Nordin? Or Could Felton be the guy that gets traded? I know a lot of teams really like him as a power runner besides the Lions. In all actuality his trade value is probably higher than Smiths right now. Do we even need a full back in this offense? If so how come Matt Clapp didn’t make the roster? I have to do some soul searching on Felton now and I am not completely sold. Either way the Lions go I am all right with it. I actually think keepign 4 backs is the way to go. Best, Brown, and Smith at halfback and Felton as the Fullback, power runner, and project. I could see the rushing snaps going something like this Best 15+ and all the rest 5ish.

Any way you cut it though I would bet cash that Morris and Dorsey are the guys cut. If smith does decent this year you might see them trade him later on and resign Morris. In fact you might see them play smith a lot before week 6 trading deadline if they want to get his value up before trading him. But I don’t think he is going to get cut. Traded maybe, but I will be surprised if he is cut.

by Evilsmurf on Aug 29, 2010 8:00 PM EDT reply actions  

I doubt they play him a lot

Coaching decisions arent made based on trade value and I doubt Felton has any sort of trade value at all. He was a 6th round pick and has done absolutely nothing in the regular season.

I agree with you that Morris will be released…he is just too expensive and his role is occupied right now by K Smith

The beginning of the end of the misery

by Latif Masud on Aug 29, 2010 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kevin Smith

Sure the guy doesn’t have breakaway speed but he does all the little things like blitz pick-ups and he is a pretty good receiver out of the backfield. To people that say he should be cut are way out of line.

by Detroitsportsfan3 on Aug 30, 2010 11:36 AM EDT reply actions  

Yes guys like K smith are so horrible

thats why the pats have kept a 3rd dow rec RB who does nothing else for a decade. And darren sprolles does so well at 185 lbs running between the tackles. Saftey valve guys keep your QB alive on blitzes. and they convert plays when the defense has every rec covered. this is just retarded.

I have a 9" personality

by Waitingfortheroar on Sep 1, 2010 12:43 PM EDT reply actions  

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