Okay... so here's my Stafford Fan Post.
Okay, so I thought I might chime in here, because I really just can’t keep my trap shut this week and overlook all the overreactions. Two straight losses, inefficiencies abounding, slow starts, sloppy play, Stafford hurt and not playing well, sky is falling, the world is ending and the Apocalypse is most certainly upon us. I just love POD after a rough loss. Certainly, there are some alarming trends and the injury to Stafford is disconcerting to say the least, but for crying out loud, where does all the sensibility go after a loss?
There is so much going on with this team, but the bottom line simply has to be this… there is an ebb and flow to an NFL season and we fans need to learn to cope with it. Wins and losses come in streaks. There are periods of consistency and inconsistency alike. At the end of the day, we lost two games to good teams by the scores of 25-19 and 23-16, respectively. Not 41-7 or 35-10. One scoring drive per game separates us from being 7-0. Essentially, that means we gave the other team a fit as well. It means it was a tough win for the opponent and a hard fought loss for us. Now sure, there are areas of concern on this team, but you have to take in all phases and look at the team objectively. And so objectively speaking, we are a tough opponent for any team despite our struggles and when we are on, we are very, very tough to beat. Fair enough? So that said, here’s my take on Stafford’s struggles as this is obviously the “hot button” issue for the fans right now….
Let’s start with what appears obvious to me, but apparently not so obvious to many... his inexperience. There’s no doubt that he has been struggling at times and especially the last two weeks, he’s simply looked off. He looks like he lost his mojo (insert Austin Powers accent here) and a lot of his confidence. More importantly, his accuracy has taken a hit because of this. It doesn’t take more than half a brain to know that these things (as well as the pocket skittishness) are all directly related. But here’s the thing… I don’t see this as a product of lack of talent or him being a below average quarterback or any of that nonsense, I see it as a product of limited experience. Say what you will, but Stafford is essentially a second year player (Sunday was his 20th game). Basically, he and Sam Bradford have about the same amount of games in, so you care to compare stats and records between the two? And some biased detractors will certainly scoff at the stats, but right now, he is a 60% passer that has thrown for 1912 yds, 16 TDs to only 4 INTs and still has a 95.5 passer rating. Granted, he hasn’t passed the eye test the last few weeks, but despite his struggles and the struggles of those around him (yeah, that’s right… he’s not the only one to blame here), he’s still one of the better quarterbacks in the league statistically and has as many wins as Brady, Brees and Roethlisburger and more wins than Sanchez, Rivers, Flacco, Schaub, Manning, Ryan, Freeman, Cutler, Kolb and yes, even more wins than the legendary Cam Newton.
He is the quarterback and with great power comes great responsibility and accountability… we all know that. They get all the blame and all the credit as well. But to blame all this on Stafford and/or think that we stand a better chance with Hill or Stanton under center is laughable. Let me state the obvious for the record here once again - Matt Stafford is 23 years old. Even with that stated, since his rookie year, he has thrown 22 TDs to 5 INTs. That’s pretty good. I think because he has had some pretty good looking stretches, we immediately lump him into the Tom Brady / Aaron Rodgers comparisons, which is horribly unfair. We as fans have to allow him learn a little bit and go through some growing pains, do we not? Is it realistic to think he is not going to struggle at all? I certainly would prefer that he be a pro bowler right away, but I think that I know that it’s possible that doesn’t happen this year.
Okay so let’s address the pocket awareness/accuracy issue (which I truly believe is one in the same). So Stafford has been noticeably uncomfortable, rushed and has had an increasing number of inaccurate passes over the last few weeks. It’s not an aberration. Ours eyes don’t lie. Stafford has been less effective, even if the stats are still somewhat good. So… what’s the deal? Yes, I attribute a lot of this is on the line, lack of rush attack, etc., but some of this is on Stafford to correct. Matt is feeling a real pass rush and a phantom pass rush right now. He’s getting hit, sacked, hurt, etc. and it’s something that he’s still learning how to manage… and doing it poorly right now. To me, the difference in his accuracy with either a solid pocket or a play that is called that effectively beats the defense is absolutely night and day. To say that Stafford is simply an “inaccurate passer” is flat out wrong. Everyone points to his college numbers or whatever, but we have seen him have entire games over 70% completion (several of those this year, btw) and we have also seen him make some jaw-dropping throws few QBs in this league can make. So what can Stafford do to correct this in the short-term? Answer… nothing.
While that may seem like a cop-out answer, it really isn’t. And you may think that I am absolving Stafford of fault here, but I am actually placing a lot of the blame on him. The problem is, how do you say “be more accurate” or “learn to not be skittish”? You can’t. He simply needs to be out there playing and learning. Each week our opponents get more tape on the Lions’ offense and it makes it harder for a young quarterback to thrive. This is why a lot of fast starts for young teams tend to taper off as the long season wears on. I think we are seeing some of that with the team and especially Stafford. So if what I said is true and Stafford just needs the experience, is that it? Does the offense just sputter until he catches up? I don’t think that’s the case at all. I think there are lots of things the offense needs to do to HELP Matt succeed while he is coming of age and it starts with the scheme.
I know that we don’t enjoy watching Best or Morris run into the back of our line and fall down for a one yard gain, but the running game has to exist in some capacity – and in a sustainable type of way over a game, not just a statistical way. If you point to the 100 yds gained in the Atlanta game and say, “See… we ran the ball well”, you didn’t actually watch the game. If you are saying that, don’t bitch about Stafford’s past few games, because statistically he was fine… he just wasn’t effective. That’s the difference. What we are seeing right now is a sheer disregard for the Lions’ run game. Teams are not blitzing us that much, knowing that they do not need their defensive line to distinguish the pass vs. the run. They are playing pass on every down and the gameplan is simply an all-out assault on Stafford and he is getting rattled… because he is young and inexperienced, not because he is a terrible quarterback. What we are also seeing is when the run game is completely ineffective, the offense begins to look a little “Martz-ian”. We see five lineman blocking, little to no chipping and no one left to pick up the blitz. Downfield routes can’t open up and the checkdowns seems to be RBs in the flats (that are well sniffed out) or screens that are becoming all too predictable.
I’m not here with all the answers. I’m actually here to say that the answer is mind-bogglingly difficult and Schwartz and Linehan have a real test on their hands. I’ll just offer up a few suggestions because I think if you’re just bitching without trying to offer up solutions, you’re just part of the problem. So….. first, they have to manufacture a meaningful run game. That might mean changing things up and bringing in a lead blocker more often. Second, let’s see more hot reads that predict that the ends are coming fast and how about getting a damn tight end to chip those ends once in a while as well. Third, light a fire under every receiver not named Pettigrew or Johnson. Where the hell did Burleson and Young disappear to? I know this is part of the learning curve, but these guys are getting a lot of single coverage and not performing well. This is putting a lot of pressure on Stafford to scramble, which is not his strong suit. I think Burleson needs to start coming across the middle more and Young needs to be slanting/posting to the inside more - play to their strengths right now. Both are much better the further they get from the sidelines. Fourth, get back to throwing it to Calvin regardless of coverage. Linehan and Stafford are out-thinking themselves in the redzone. That used to be our bread and butter, now we are just trying to get cute too often. Stop it. Lastly, fans chill out. We are 5-2 and if anyone would have had a crystal ball before the season and told the rest of POD we would be 5-2, we would all have been very happy about that. The sky is not falling. Judgment Day is not here. The Apocalypse is not upon us.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Pride of Detroit or its writers. FanPosts are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable fans.
214 comments
|
8 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
.....Not one mention of his hot girl friend draining him of his mojo before games....
I’m disappointed you didn’t acknowledge that obvious possibility.
http://twitter.com/#!/rumbulls
LOL
I’m fine with 5-2, a win on Sunday will cure most of the drama around here. Stafford is gonna have bad games and yesterday was one of them. I don’t like some of the play calling though, I thought that with Best out some of the run plays would of changed with Morris back there…. NOPE….
Was they get back to the basics they’ll be fine…
Sensiable and accurate
I’m stunned a post like this can still exsist LOL. We no more of these Drew! Honestly I agree %100 Stafford is in his 3rd year but dosen’t have much more than 1 season under his belt. CHILL PEOPLE! He needs the O line to me more reliable give him time and as he gets time to make throws his confidence and big plays will return.
"To have won the Indy 500 and the championship is very special." - Dan Wheldon
PCP 4 LIFE
Good post Drew
But on the same token, we all saw what Stafford is capable of in the early games this season. It is not overly negative, or even overly dramatic, to wonder quietly (if not out loud) what is going on with him.
The offensive line has sucked for the last two weeks, but Stafford had ALL day to run for a first down in the 4th quarter, yet he decided to run up and throw the ball to a well covered Calvin Johnson, for a critical incompletion. Lack of experience? Mostly. Lack of common sense? Partially. It is not an entirely bad thing to expect more out of your starting, franchise QB…regardless of what year he is in.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Lack of talent? Lack of ability?
No. He has all kinds of those things, and I doubt anyone with a pair of eyes and at least a partially functioning brain will disagree.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Back to lack of experience...
I think where his inexperience shows the most is in his inability to pick-up secondary receivers; locking on to the primary. This will come in time.
The coolest Lion nickname ever belongs to Dick "NIGHT TRAIN" Lane.
Detroit... putting the OFFENSIVE in OL.
Follow me: Following B00Bs
by Gee Garold Lembach on Oct 26, 2011 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, I don't blame him for throwing one up for Calvin.
If that had been Burleson or Young down there, I would have said WTF. But he had single coverage and just underthrew it a bit.
I hear you though. I wonder what is going on too. Honestly, I think he’s just had his confidence shaken and a few good series and he’s back in. I think the playcalling has been partially to blame. His first and second read are either not open or time runs out before they do open up.
I think it’s fine to expect Stafford to play well… and he has. But to think he’s going to be lights out each week, especially early on… not realistic. I think we all need to spend more time watching the good quarterbacks in the league struggle. It’s part of being an NFL quarterback. NO ONE is great all the time (except Rodgers this year…. good God).
I watched the play in person
Calvin Johnson was in single coverage, but the corner was all over him and Stafford OVER threw the ball. I know CJ has mad ups and all, but when you are running to catch a ball in-stride, you’re not going to be able to use your height and vertical jumping advantages to BEAT single coverage. If Stafford would have thrown the ball short, then maybe Calvin would have been able to catch the ball.
The middle of the field, where Stafford ran up to, stopped, and threw the ball from…had NO defenders within a 15 yard radius of Stafford when he threw the ball. He could have, and definitely should have, ran for the first down. Why try to throw a deep ball to Calvin Johnson on 3rd and long, unless he is WIDE open, when the defense is giving you the first down?? I know you dislike the comparisons to the great QBs in the NFL, but Rodgers would have ran it…hell TEBOW would have ran it! I think Peyton Manning could have run for a first down on that play…
I agree with you though…nobody can be great all of the time, and the play calling has most definitely been suspect to say the least. However, I am not really seeing Stafford even try to make ANY reads on a lot of plays. Either he actually doesn’t have time to make more than 1 read, he perceives that he does not have time to make more than 1 read, or he simply is not making more than 1 read. He focuses too long on the receiver that the play is intended to go to…or in other words, he is too slow at making ALL of his reads. THAT is inexperience. I also believe he will get quicker on his reads, in due time.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
by KDawg on Oct 24, 2011 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Wasn't that the play where Calvin had to slow up and then....
Grimes had good position? Maybe I’ve got that play mixed up with another one. Either way… yeah, he could have ran it. BUT… (lol) I don’t ever fault Stafford for being aggressive and wanting to make a play, especially to Calvin. I’ll probably always feel that way.
I think Stafford has a good ability to read the defense and I’m not sure I agree 100% with the notion he stares down his hot read all the time. I just think that the defense is just giving him so much more problems because of the way they play against our strengths now and the lack to more than 2 seconds before the line comes crashing through. The answer to the fix is kind of complicated, IMO and they just have to start making the adjustments that start putting him in situations that are successful and then let him execute and in the process learn.
I agree that the lack of protection is one reason...
But even when he has had time, his head does not seem to be on a swivel. Maybe his eyes are moving…but none of us can see that. I watch other QBs…and when their “hot read” is not open, you can see their head move through their progressions. I’m not saying Stafford NEVER does that, but I just feel he has some work to do on making his reads quicker.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Noted.
From what I can see on TV replays though, he does work through his reads when he has time. And I also think that he knows based on coverage where he wants to go. For whatever reason, he’s struggled with finding someone open lately.
His receivers aren't helping a lot either
Other than CJ and Grew.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Yup.
I mean, Titus has had some nice catches, but he just doesn’t seem to get open a lot. And Burleson hasn’t been doing much since week 2.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
I don't think Titus has seen more than single coverage
since college.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
As long as we’re all sort of armchair quarterbacking and analyzing what the cause and effects are I’d like to offer the following comments.
1, I think some of his “reads” are deliberately limited by the coaches to help keep him upright, especially against aggressive defensive fronts.
2, All quarterbacks go through periods when they look for “a favorite receiver”.
3, Titus Young is still very young, and just like Stafford he needs a little more time to get a better understanding of the playbook. Also I expect him to become a much better (craftier) route runner particularly after he fully adjusts to the increased speed of the NFL.
4, I would like to see Scott Lenihan become a little more creative with his play calling. Since our running game is struggling so badly, AND with Calvin Johnson’s size I would like to see Scott used Calvin, Pettigrew, and Scheffler in a three tight end arrangement. He could align them in a jumbo run look formations to one side and run the ball. Or he could start out with that same jumbo formation and motion Calvin to a wideout and it should create a favorable mismatch. Another option would be from the same formation to send Burleson on an end around to the jumbo side and you have all those blockers in front of them. Or he could begin with a jumble look motion Pettigrew to the weak side, then drop both tight ends to the backfield for a maximum protection situation. Those are just a few of the cute little tricks three tight ends give an offensive coordinator. Using them that way you usually end up with mismatches with too many linebackers which are not as fast as CB’s. What’s sweet is that you can always line them up in a more conventional passing alignment, then motioned him into a jumbo at any time also, which gives you mismatches with CB’s on the field, for plays requiring linebackers, another mismatch.
5, Why is it that we always say “we pass the ball to set up the run” yet on first down we almost always run the ball?
by Jeff Lamphere on Oct 25, 2011 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I actually read that whole thing.
And couldn’t find a point that i disagreed with….
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
Even Orlovsky would've ran the ball on that play
only backwards
We didn't lose the games, we just ran out of time -- Bobby Layne
Good Post
Like a lot of others I believe it stems from the play calling. The Lions are not a running team. Even if we had Best and Leshoure, we would still not be a running team.
I believe we need to throw to establish the run. This is exactly what Green Bay, New Orleans, New England, and a healthy Manning led Colts team does. As you can see those are successful teams. These teams do not force feed the run.
I still believe we should go no huddle. And I mean no huddle not hurry up. This is the same scheme New England does and forces the defense not to substitute personnel. If we go 3 WOs, TE, and RB in the backfield, this will open up a lot of opportunities for Stafford. Let him get comfortable earlier instead of run, run, pass, and then punt. Offense is not clicking in the first half, let’s open it up a little.
This is a great post.
And I agree whole heartedly with everything you said Drew. But also Stafford doesnt have to be great every week. Maybe he wasnt effective the last to weeks and didnt have great games but he was horrible either. How many interceptions did he throw? How many fumbles did he have? And yeah maybe he didnt put the team on his shoulders and carry them for the win. But let me ask you this when some of those QB’s mentioned above had bad games they had people stepping up and doing things. Who has doen this for Stafford the last 2 weeks? Who has stepped up and said well hell our QB is having a rough time what can I do to help? Just by the statistics you can see Johnson (but in all honestly this should be the norm) and a couple games you have seen Pettigrew. Aren’t there 8 other players on the field? What are they doing to help?
sorry typo in there
should say he wasnt horrible either.
Yeah, that plays into what I said about Burleson and Young.
I give Young a bit of a reprieve as he is “young” and missed a lot of time early on. But Burleson? Dude is not picking up any of the slack.
Agreed.
Where is the Burleson from the preseason? Where is the man who said he was going to be the black Wes Welker? And I think alot of people got over excited when they saw that huge 5-0 line too. This is still a young team with a winning record and there is still alot of football left to be played. To be honest this team is still heading in the dirrection I thought they would be in this year and that is a chance at a playoff wildcard. Not a garunteed chance at the playoffs but a chance. They have alot of room to grow and still need some key personnel to be a pereniall playoff contender.
Burleson is pissing me off, and not just because of the 2 losses. The guy has never found a mic that he doesn't want talk into to.
But Burleson? Dude is not picking up any of the slack.
He’s everywhere, and on every show, and if you read his Twitter, he has all sorts of appearances during the week. Maybe a little less “Nate”, and a little more focus on “team” would go a long way in helping his performance on the field.
doubt it
I think it’s a mix of Stafford not throwing to him when he’s open (I’ve seen it a bunch) and at other times him not getting the separation he needs to as of late. A talking vet has nothing to do with “focus” and what not…
The Dis-Assembly Line - The unofficial, official name for the next best D-line in football.
Yeah agreed.
I think it has nothing to do with Nate and his extracurricular activity, because he’s always strap them up for game day. I have mixed emotions about Yarno… although you can’t argue with those statistics. He brought a new offensive line system that statistically looks pretty good. However this season it’s not looking as promising as it did last season. Of course last season was a three quarterback season for all intents and purposes, so teams couldn’t game plan for one quarterback only. Which is probably why we were one of the best protecting offensive lines. We still need better players on the offensive line, and Green Bay has no problem with developing players quickly. The Green Bay Falcon game proves that when both of their offensive tackles left the game with injuries. They brought in a first or second year tackle and the other guy was a rookie, and both of them played very well, which gave Rogers all the time he needed in the pocket. We need much more “BEEF” on the offensive line is this group of talented players are going to go anywhere.
by Jeff Lamphere on Oct 25, 2011 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Only Newhouse played well actually
and he wasn’t super by any means. The Pack has improved their oline but it still isn’t stellar. I’m not sure anyone’s is/ The Dlineman throughout the league are overall superior to their counterparts. Roger’s escapability makes up for a lot. Last year the Pack overcame a lot of injuries better than they were able to overcome the loss of Clifton the year before.
Someone is alive today simply because I can't afford a hitman.
by Justan Oldfart on Oct 25, 2011 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I would agree however
Nate had three passes to him last game.The screen pass was not his fault that it was almost no gain considering the way the ball was thrown to him put him in a horrible posistion to make a play.But the other two were drops that were IMO inexcusible.That 3rd down drop in the 4th quarter was awful totally on nate.
Since early in the season
I have not seen many passes to the following: Burleson, Scheffler (it seems like Heller gets more thrown his way), Rashied Davis, Stovall. The first two games these guys were making an impact. Hell, do Davis or Stovall even get offensive reps anymore? This is my big shout out to Burleson and Scheffler; wake the F$&% up!!! We were effective when we spread the ball around and switched our personnel. We seem to have gotten away from that.
Davis has been hurt
but agree otherways. Hell does Stovall even play ST? I thought he could be a good “x” factor on this team. And after seeing Scheffler have big game againtst Tampa Bay he has been a non factor. Bernard Berrian just got released.. if we have the cap do we make a move? Ehh its a thought because it seems like no one is getting open
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
Stovall plays ST...
He hasn’t been doing much though…
As for Berrian….just…..no.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
Great Post
It’s about time we had some positive thinking. I agree with so many of your points but I think the biggest is the way opposing defences are playing us. When you are rarely getting blitzed and its just a 4 man rush its tough for the receivers to get open. Without any semblance of a running game we have to find other ways to move the chains.
My biggest disappointment comes with the lack of focus for the team right now. They are taking way too many penalties again this year and a lot of them are just plain stupid penalties that seem to bite us at the wrong time, or we get a call at a key point that goes against us and seems to sap the energy. Case in point the penalty they called back (the PI call in the 4th) because of the tip at the line. It was the right call but if the lineman misses that ball we get a first down and who knows from there. Alas, it was 4th and 10 and we didnt convert. I think it was the same set of downs where Burleson was wide open on the sideline and just let the ball slip right through his hands. Those are the plays that a veteran like Burleson needs to make and tends to make Stafford look bad.
All in all like DrewsLions said above…if someone told you that the Lions would be 5-2 at this point I think we all would have taken that at the start of the season. Lets be patient and remember that this is a young team and sometimes in order to take that next step you have to lose a bit.
They did it for Savy, they did it for Horton, they did it for each other, they did it for us. I give you the 2011 Stanley Cup Champions....The Boston Bruins!!
Thank you Drew
I think this echos the point i was trying to get across as well in my other fanpost!
Interesting stat
Lions have a 4.1 ypc average. Packers have a 3.8 average
but it would be welllll under 4
without Best’s huge run on MNF. Not saying that a huge play like that shouldn’t count towards averages, just saying the Lion’s 4.1 ypc is a bit optimistic and doesn’t reflect their true ground game
by Suhper Megatron on Oct 24, 2011 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
and where would the Packers average be without their big runs?
Every team has big runs and they actually count a lot more than you give credit for. The running game immediately gets the attention of the defense when they can break big plays and put points on the board. The big play ability forces the other team to be honest even when the majority of your runs are for little or no gain. When Best is in the game the defenses are forced to account for him and play the run. When we do not have Best the defense pays less attention to the running game because the big play threat is not really there.
The real goal of a balanced offense is to force the defense to play both run and pass honestly. The Lions do not have to run for a lot of yards, they just have to present enough of a running threat to keep the defense playing honestly. They have to force the safety up into the box on occasion to make more opportunity for the pass to work. If the defense can play with two deep safeties the entire game the passing game will suffer.
Listen to the Two Bro's Talk podcast!
Follow @tufflynx
I think Best's 88 yard run skews it a bit.
Although I’m sure the Packers have their biggies as well.
Fan of the Detroit Tigers, Lions and Red Wings.
It's funny.
How people say we don’t have a running game because the long runs are flukes, but then flip it back around and say we don’t have a running D because of the long runs given up.
"You've got to respect your opponent, no matter who it is. You respect him best by going out there and beating him up." - Calvin Johnson
by Mavyrk on Oct 25, 2011 10:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
without that run
it’d be about 3.6
but even then. I’m sure the Packers have had a 50 yard run or something
Starks has had some runs in the 30's and his long is 40 yards.
Listen to the Two Bro's Talk podcast!
Follow @tufflynx
True for what that’s worth, and here’s my point. Frank Gore had 15 runs against us and had 141 yards for a 9.4 yard average, in all reality he averaged 51 yards on two of those carries, but only 3.0 yards on the remaining 13 carries, so this statistic isn’t all that useful. A lot of statistics look favorable in many categories, but unless you’re consistently doing so they’re very misleading as Frank Gore’s games stat’s verified.
by Jeff Lamphere on Oct 25, 2011 6:59 PM EDT up reply actions
see, I look at those stats as very telling
15 runs for 141 yards with a 9.4 yard average is exceptionally telling. That is how a modern running game works today. 3 yards here, 3 yards there hoping to break off a 50 yard run.
It tells me, we stink against the run.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Except that isn't true.
People keep saying that is how a modern running game works today. Except it isn’t. Every run and every yard isn’t equal. We have one of the best runSR% rates on D in the leagues, our run D according to DVOA is exceptional, our 3rd down conversion rate is great, our short yardage power running D is great, etc.
People keep saying that every rushing game is short runs sprinkled with a couple longs, but we do FAR better on the shorts than most teams, which comprise of the vast majority of runs. Teams rushing against us just are not effective, stats or eyes. At no point in any game have I ever felt an offense was owning the ground game against this D.
"You've got to respect your opponent, no matter who it is. You respect him best by going out there and beating him up." - Calvin Johnson
by Mavyrk on Oct 25, 2011 10:21 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I will agree with that statement with one exception
The only time I am ever convinced we will win in a running situation is on the short yardage to go downs. In that area, I think we excel. The rest of the time, I truly believe we are average at best, horrible at worst.
Those two 50 yard scampers by Gore were about more than just yards. They were about one scheme beating another scheme, soundly. That is how our defense is defeated and it is no coincidence we lost that game or the Atlanta game.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Oh come on....
Gore got lucky on those runs….We should have shut those down in the backfield, but we just missed….nothing but luck on those two
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
I do not buy that
I say those plays over and over. The O lineman broke free and caused havoc in our secondary. People around here have been bashing Carp for his role in those running plays. He was fighting an O lineman with a head of steam that out weighed him by 50+ pounds. That is by design.
Those two runs were a great scheme that took advantage of our D line’s scheme.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
+1
Yooperlionfan is officially "the man"
the Lions D-Line: the Four Horsemen of the A-sack-alypse
Jim Schwartz: Erasing the stink of Millen, one fist pump at a time.
P.C.P: It is not just for recreation anymore.
I will agree
That we need to be better at stopping those wham runs. Atlanta did it to us a couple times and it worked.A bit less effective but none the less it worked.I did however notice we used that wham play on offense and it worked for us as well.But we only used it once and went away from it.
teams saw the Niners wham play and what it did against the Wide 9 formation
now Atlanta was trying to do it. I am sure Denver will use it also.
Yooperlionfan is officially "the man"
the Lions D-Line: the Four Horsemen of the A-sack-alypse
Jim Schwartz: Erasing the stink of Millen, one fist pump at a time.
P.C.P: It is not just for recreation anymore.
Very true
I love the wide 9 as long as our back 7 are makin plays. The wham was very effective and i wouldnt be surprised to see tebow run it a couple of times
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
Trying to is the operative word.
They didn’t have as much success. And contrary to popular belief, SF wasn’t the first time the HB wham was attempted, it’s just getting a lot of undue press because of some outliers.
This defense is good. Flat out good. There isn’t a defense in the league, not Baltimore’s, not San Francisco’s, not anybody’s that I can honestly say is just plain better than ours. Our defense is the class of the league. Now only if our STs and O would show up to the party.
"You've got to respect your opponent, no matter who it is. You respect him best by going out there and beating him up." - Calvin Johnson
by Mavyrk on Oct 26, 2011 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I still do not agree
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4I2KSNXvaU
Just watched this, of Gore’s runs vs the Lions, and I only see one play that was the result of a great scheme. Delmas had a few missed tackles, and we had Gore in the backfield on one of them, and he just wriggled free.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
I've seen the HB Wham attempted by multiple teams in several games this year.
It’s only gone long those two times. Yeah, it’s had a couple pops for 5s, 8s, maybe a 13 if they bounce outside and get some stellar blocking from WRs, but it’s not a repeatable method to win.
Running games aren’t about the big plays, running games are about consistently beating down the door, demoralizing the opponent, controlling the clock and converting first down. No team, not one single team, has come even CLOSE to doing that to our defense.
"You've got to respect your opponent, no matter who it is. You respect him best by going out there and beating him up." - Calvin Johnson
I think our D has been stellar.
They get the job done when they are on the field and hold our opponents to the least amount of points possible.Its not their fault that between ST and a stagnant offense that they get tired out towards the end of games and spend wayyyy too much time on the field.
Joshun
The problem with the run defense is that the defensive line is pinning their ears back to rush the passer and they really are not playing the run on the way as they claim. I am sure they would like to play the run on the way, but the opposing offensive linemen have been very smart against the Lions defensive line. When the play is a run they actually allow the Lions defensive tackles to get penetration and overrun the play. All they do is seal the Lions defender away from the runner and let them use their own speed to run themselves right out of a tackling angle.
The Falcons game is the first time I have seen Suh actually stop trying to kill the passer on every play and pay some real attention to the run. Consequently, he got two stops in the Atlanta backfield. Now we just need to get the rest of the defensive line doing the same thing.
There have been some bad run fits by the linebackers as well. They have mainly come from Levy and Carpenter. I understand that it is not easy to play off a block from a pulling guard, but that is what outside linebackers need to do fairly often. There are a number of offensive plays that specifically seek that match up, and the linebacker needs to be able to get off that block. They have to avoid letting the guard latch onto them cleanly by using their hands well and moving laterally. Then if the guard tries to latch on they get a holding call.
The Lions ahve also had some problems with bad pursuit angles by safeties and poor tackling all across the board. There are too many arm tackles being broken and not enough guys breaking down and wrapping up properly.
There it is, those are the problems with the run defense. Every one of them is coachable. Every one of them can be eliminated. I feel it is just a matter of time for those issues to be eliminated.
Listen to the Two Bro's Talk podcast!
Follow @tufflynx
by TuffLynx on Oct 26, 2011 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
there was one season without ebb and flow
i’m not sure if it was ebb or flow, but it was definitely only one way
Yeah, I think I remember that...
1979, I think. It was definitely ebb. There was zero ebb that year. What a strange season that was……..
Stafford
His arm angle was messed up again yesterday. I’m honestly wondering if he slightly tweaked his shoulder. If not, that is something he can correct in the short term.
I get the point saying we’re 5-2 and we should be happy, but 5-3 is also a good record and I think it’s going to be impossible to tell any Lions fan that that should be ok to accept.
Fan of the Detroit Tigers, Lions and Red Wings.
+10
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
Is our defence to blame?
Maybe we should look at our defence as reason why Staff is so rushed in games. I would expect having such a good pass defence would help him get comfortable real quick. Can you imagine having to practice against or D-Line, one red jersey from death at the hands of Suh or Vanden Bosch. But perhaps since other teams are not sending the pass rush that we do, our o-line is getting trapped into thinking they are doing their job in the middle. Maybe we should have the PS play some weak rushes and allow Stafford to practice finding a double covered receiver more often.
Generally this is how an NFL team practices, it's not the reason for his troubles.
President of the Tony Scheffler Fan Club
Remember the Packers last year?
Remember how everyone was throwing McCarthy under the bus last year when the Packers lost to the Redskins and Dolphins…about how he can’t call plays, A-Rod is over-rated, blah blah blah…its a long season, lets hope these last 2 games have motivated the team and we can look back to games 6 & 7 as having defined the character of the team. Keeping things in perspective is key.
Moving forward beyond the past, but not shutting the door to it...
The road to becoming winners is paved with the good memories as well as the bad, with backslides along the way. I’m with you, and believe these guys have the character to have learned something about what it takes to become winners. We have witnessed the team not getting too high with the wins, nor too low with the losses; the motivation to snap out of a tailspin is next.
A win Sunday is needed to set up their resolve, to take care of business within the division at Chicago. They don’t want to be licking their wounds for 2 weeks before taking on the Bears; everyone knows it. I suspect we will see a motivated Lions’ team in Denver this week, and that they will work hard to deliver a win over the Broncos.
The coolest Lion nickname ever belongs to Dick "NIGHT TRAIN" Lane.
Detroit... putting the OFFENSIVE in OL.
Follow me: Following B00Bs
by Gee Garold Lembach on Oct 27, 2011 7:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Let's go
on a nice run again. Denver, Bears, and Panthers. Three wins would look real nice with GB and N.O. after that.
I'd even settle with 7-3
The Bears aren’t a bad team by any means, and we had a hard time with Forte before (and it’s in Chicago this time), Denver and Carolina are both winnable games. 8-3 would be nice, but Green Bay on Thanksgiving is going to be one hell of a game
Fan of the Tigers ~ Red Wings ~ Lions - No Better Town to be a sports fan of!
Fantasy Teams: PoD Bench League (PackMules (2-4)) / WIIM Mursak League (Wingedmule (8-5-2))
Finally, a spot on assumption. Good write up.
Really, sounded like some good old fashion common sense. I think the biggest problem is the O-line but I’m sure that will be addressed this offseason. The thing I see is they are not making any corrections at halftime. There should be some things that they can address at halftime to help him with receiver routs, play calling, blocking schemes, etc. It looks like they do it for the defense but not for the offense. What’s weird is it looked like they were making adjustments in the first 5 games but not the last two. IMO.
Thanks, drew, for bringing everyone back in the window off the ledge
There are so many new guys here, I check out after the game and let everyone get the frustration out and then give it a try Monday or Tuesday but anyways…
Teams hit a rough patch and there are growing pains especially with no offseason to get the cohesion down. Sure we started up hot and got some wins under our belts, but not many thought we could be 6-2 (barring a tebow moiracle) at the bye week. We just need to keep getting better, I’m hoping we get our first complete game together in time for the packers. A big showing on turkey day would do so much for our confidence and momentum.
All we need is a playoff birth and then anything can happen boys, we have the talent to put a hurting on if they take us lightly.
Matthew Stafford, Quarterback: a man barely alive, Gentlemen we can rebuild him, We have the technology, We have the capability to make the worlds first bionic QB, Matthew Stafford will be that man, Better than he was before
Better, Stronger, Faster
They said we were a one trick pony, talkin bout CALVIN. Well thats one hell of a TRICK!!!! - Nate B.
by Gyorick on Oct 24, 2011 5:59 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Guys...
The Lions had 104 rushing yards in this week’s game…the running game did a pretty decent job, considering. Morris and Williams combined for 94 yards…so the no running game excuse is BUNK.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Lol...
Well, bunk is a very strong word considering that it was nowhere near a consistent running game. 104 yards for the team isn’t a ton and we had a few chunk plays. There were LOTS of 1 and 2 yd runs yesterday. It was better, but not great. It was definitely not enough for the Falcons to stop playing pass on EVERY down.
That's your opinion
And that’s fine. My opinion is that the running game was average, and adequate enough.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Dude...
Only 3 teams this week had rushing totals that were more than 30-50 yards more than Detroit put up against Atlanta. Do we have to have a 200 yard rusher in order to have a running game that you consider “consistent and decent”?
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
I think it was a good rushing day
but I also think that was a result of Atlanta putting more of their efforts into stopping our passing game.
That is one of our problems right now. We can’t make the other team suffer for focusing on one aspect of our offense. Staff is just not there yet.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Ahhh
So there we are, getting closer to the REAL problem. The problem here is not the running game. It is that opposing defenses do not respect our running game, coupled with the FACT that we do not spread the ball around enough to receivers NOT named Calvin Johnson and Brandon Pettigrew.
I’ve seen a lot of people here, and heard a lot more on the radio, saying that Calvin Johnson does NOT get enough targets…
Are you kidding me? The fact that he is pretty much our only REAL threat has already caused opposing defenses to game plan SOLELY to stop him. Now people want the Lions to throw him the ball 35-40% of all of our plays? I think the coaches need to seriously rethink the amount of balls that TITUS YOUNG should be getting out of the SLOT (on underneath routes and over the short middle), Nate Burleson on the outside (SLANTS and short middle routes as well), and Tony Scheffler (dumps and short middle routes), rather than focusing MORE on Calvin Johnson and Brandon Pettigrew. Just because Jahvid Best is out, and he isn’t there as a release valve (or to throw screens to), does not mean that we should NOT throw more balls to Young and Burleson in SPACE (give them a chance to run after the catch for Christ’s sake)! Scheffler seemed to be the only guy catching the damn ball yesterday…why don’t we throw to him more often? Is it because we are worried about CJ’s ego? I don’t get it.
The running game is SECOND priority on this team. If you don’t believe it, do some reading on what Scott Linehan believes, and how he describes our offense.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
And to be clear (Josh I am not attacking you)...
I am NOT saying that a stronger running game would not HELP. I am saying that it is NOT the reason we can’t move the GD ball. That is due to a lack of protection up front on passing plays, a lack of DIVERSITY in our passing game with the VANILLA BULLSHIT CONSERVATIVE play calling, AND a running game that is average to slightly below.
I do believe a stronger running game would help, but I DO NOT believe it is the real problem with how our offense has performed in the last 2 games.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Never took your comment as an attack
I firmly believe we need to create schemes to get other players involved in the game plan more. I remember some very nice deep throws to Titus early in the season. Where have those gone? nate has basically been invisible this season. Did he screw one of Staffs ex girlfriends?
We need to mix stuff up a whole hell of a lot more and Staff needs to go threw his progressions better. I am tired of him seeing one guy covered and bailing out on the play with happy feet.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
I agree with a lot of what you and Josh are saying here, KDawg.
The running game is surely not the only problem, but it’s still an issue because of how the opposing defenses are playing us. They don’t RESPECT the run… that’s the difference. The Lions are seeing defenses that are giving the passing game fits and they need to mix it up and beat it, because they are going to see it every week.
I agree KD
The running game is adequate. Heck, ask Green Bay if they would like 100 yds rushing, they say Hell Yeah. And we need to pass to set up our run. GB, NE, and NO does it.
I wonder if things come down to trust. Does Stafford really trust any receivers besides CJ and Grew. Seems like in a pinch those are the only guys Stafford looks at. Burleson and Young should be able to beat their man or be able to find the soft spots in zone coverage. Especially when CJ is getting over the top safety help.
No doubt
Atlanta ran a BASE 4-3, cover 2, for almost the entire game against us. Why didn’t we throw slants, digs, and curls to Burleson and Young? Stafford tried to throw 2-3 outs. Burleson dropped one of those, and Stafford missed on the throw for the others tries. Atlanta was simply rolling their safeties to the outside, giving over the top help on our #1 and #2 receivers the entire game. It left the middle of the field, behind the linebackers, WIDE OPEN. But did we exploit that? Nope. If Burleson and Young can’t beat LINEBACKERS, then what good are they? I think they CAN, but the play calling did not allow for it. Epic failure on the part of Linehan, and also on Stafford if indeed he WAS calling audibles that were incorrect.
I’m not a professional QB or coach…but I think Ray Charles could see what was happening. I was just shell shocked that the Lions didn’t.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Schwartz in his round of weekly interviews isn't sounding very tickled with the play calling the last 2 weeks.
He’s dancing around on the answers but he certainly not patting Linehan on the back.
Good. He shouldn't be pleased at all.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
It is bunk
The Falcons had some 1 and 2 yard runs, but never stopped trying. No run, no playoffs.
Just sayin
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
absolutely not true.
Look at the colts with Manning. Their running game since James has been less than stellar but they’ve made the playoffs.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
I'm saying
Good teams do not give up on the run. If you are pass only, the D will just pin their ears back and blitz.
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
We haven't really given up on the run....
we’ve just struggled in finding an effective form of run that works out of our base offense… which is the shotgun, single-back set.
Maybe
the base offense needs some adjusting then. I liked how we ran Sunday at times, however, I don’t see enough of a comittment to keep defenses honest
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
The bye week is at the right time
Adjustments can be made for all 3 units.
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
Specially for injuries.
Even if Staff isnt 100% this week the bye week will certanly help
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
What?
Didnt our Divison Rivals the Green Bay Packers basically give up on the run in the 2nd half in the Super Bowl? I knew they were passing every play and Aaron completely picked the Steelers defense apart. Sorry but i dont agree
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
I was saying the excuse of no running game, for the passing game's woes, is bunk...
Because we did have a relatively decent running game vs Atlanta, considering.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
did my due diligence
15 of the Lions’ 20 running plays went for 3 yards or less, and none of those 15 earned a first down. To me, that is pretty inefficient running.
I understand your point of veiw
But you need to keep the defense honest
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
Your opinion
I disagree. This offense is not a running offense. It was built to throw the ball. The 3 yard runs are simply there to keep the defenses honest. It is no different than Green Bay or any other great passing team that doesn’t have a strong running game.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
I completely agree that you need to continue to run the ball
I just think we’re inefficient at it and it’s hurting the offense as much as it’s helping it.
But that's just the problem here man...
You think it is inefficient, but it really isn’t much worse than many other successful teams that are pass heavy on offense.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
many other teams?
Green Bay….Jets?….Giants?
Look, I know that teams CAN be successful without a running game, but it’s a lot harder. You need to have an absolutely elite passing game, and let’s face the facts, our offensive line and Stafford’s inconsistencies have deemed this passing game non-elite as of late.
Look at the stat lines from every game this week
Like I said…there were only THREE teams that have played so far this week, and WON, who rushed for MORE than 30-50 yards more than the Lions. Meaning 94 + 30-50 = 124-144 ish.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
doesn't mean much to me
I’m not asking for more yards, I’m asking for more effective runs. Our running game isn’t a big enough threat for the defense to start devoting extra men to the box. We’re seeing less and less effective play-action plays. It’s also part of the reason we’re caught in so many third-and-longs, hence the 1-11 conversion rate.
Sims I am 100% in
Extra men in the box is good ( ask Paris Hilton ), it opens up the passing game up.
If you have a beware of the dog sign on your house, and an I love my pittbull bumber sticker, the chance of a break in just dropped.
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
Wrong
Penalties AND the times when we get caught below our own average YPC are the main reason why we’re caught in so many 3rd and longs. If we are averaging 3.1 yards per carry, as you suggest, then we should be in 3rd and shorts if we run on both 1st AND 2nd down.
We are shooting for 3rd and 4 or 5 everytime. That is how I see Linehan play calling it too. Too conservative.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
By the way...
Morris and Williams versus Atlanta? They combined for 94 yards on 18 carries…that is a 5.2 YPC average. Not effective? I guess we need guys that run for a first down every time they touch the ball huh?
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
A good article, no doubt...
However, I still disagree. Here is my reply to Ty’s post:
I don’t think you are wrong Ty…I still think Morris is a decent 1st and 2nd down running back. The only difference between your definition of being right or wrong is based on some made up definition of what is and is not successful. The Lions are not a running team…point blank. They are built to pass the ball. The running backs are not expected to gain 4 yards per carry on first down in this offense, but rather they are simply expected to carry the ball, with hope that they will gain positive yards. I am not advocating that a stronger running game would not help the Lion’s offense tremendously, but if the Packers can do it then so can the Lions. I believe that Morris and Williams WERE effective against the Falcons, but regardless of what Morris and Williams did, Atlanta was committed to staying in a pass defense. Because they did not take the bait, knowing full well that the true danger of the Lion’s offense is their passing game, they were able to limit the Lion’s passing offense.
For those that want to blame an ineffective running game for this, I suggest that you take a look at the effectiveness of the offensive line. The lack of protection and poor run blocking were public enemy #1 and #2 to the Lion’s overall effectiveness on offense. The third problem, more important than the running game as well, was the inaccuracy of Matthew Stafford’s passes when he DID throw the ball, his refusal (or maybe commitment to the coaches) to run for yards when nobody was open, AND the lack of receivers actually getting open! Then you have dropped balls and stupid penalties to add to these problems. To say that the running game was “ineffective” and name that as the reason why the Lion’s had so many three and outs, is nothing short of short sighted, if not downright ignorant (no offense intended).
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
by KDawg on Oct 26, 2011 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
you and i agree on a lot
You say point to the o-line as much of the problem for the offensive struggles and I completely agree. They are failing on both the running and passing fronts.
I’m about to post a video review of a couple running plays, one successful and one…not so much. Let me know what you think.
Will do
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Are you posting here?
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
it's not about total yards
in this case because there were two big runs. What about the TON of 1 yard gains that set up 3rd and longs? We can’t be having that every single series… We need to get WAY better on 1st down IMO! And it starts with the play calling. I’m not so pissed that they run, but it’s the shotgun run in the A gap shit that pisses me off. EVERYONE in the stadium knew when those runs were coming. Linehan did a good job with misdirections to start the game and when Keiland Williams was in. Those were scripted and drawn up in preparation for the game. You could tell. It was when we went back to our bread and butter…our bread and butter absolutely needs to be a different kind of play!
The Dis-Assembly Line - The unofficial, official name for the next best D-line in football.
BINGO!
The problem is that the Lions are too easy to figure. They do not connect enough on short quick passes. Where are all the quick slants, curls and digs? The running game was effective enough to win in the Falcons game. The problem is that the short passing game has fallen apart.
In the Falcons game the Lions ran the ball 20 times and the plays went for one yard or less six times. That is not great, but it is not the reason that the Lions lost. The reason they lost is that Matthew Stafford is not completing the short passes for effective plays. There were numerous times in this game that Stafford simply did not connect with open receivers.
Listen to the Two Bro's Talk podcast!
Follow @tufflynx
Exactly
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Totally agree
I hate 1st down play calling too. I mean why are we running shot gun delays with Keiland Williams and MoMo? I think the only people on our team that can do that is Best and maybe Logan.
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
Drew
A few weeks ago, I talked about how Stafford’s production was falling off and you brushed it off then. Now after two losses in which he has played increasingly worse game to game we are supposed to just brush it off again?
Sorry man, I am not buying it. He has happy feet, he is feeling the rush 3 seconds before it is even close to him. He is feeling the physical wear and tear of the season and it is taking it’s toll on him. Anyone with eyes could see this happening over the last 4
+ games.
His QBR for this last game. 18.6! That is miserable. Horrible. A 50 score is average. 18.6 is atrocious. Like I said before, He started the season off hot and has been slowly falling off. He needs a reset and this week off, after the Denver game, will hopefully serve him very well. These next 4+ games after the Denver game could well define his career. He needs to settle down in the pocket, trust his blockers (yeah I know!) and hit his guys when they are open. He looks like a scared QB to me right now and that is not a good thing.
How do people not recognize a scared QB around here? We have seen so many of them in our lifetime being Lions fans.
I want to believe he can get his “pocket courage” back but it is all going to fall on his shoulders.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
I kind of agree with you
he looks rushed when he shouldnt be. I think he is was just REALLY really hot and will cool off because we can keep up number like that? The offense was out of sync the whole game and i think thats what lost us the game
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
well
We really have been slow starters for the bulk of the season. That is something we have not been able to work out at any point yet. Initially, I wrote the slow starts off to a young QB who was just a bit too amped to get out there playing and that was probably true in the first couple games. These last few games it has evolved from over amped young QB to scared young QB and I am genuinely concerned about his mental part of the game. This is a big moment for Linny and JS. They have to find a way to coach that fear outta him. I do not envy their job.
The over throws, missed open players. Those are the kind of throws often made by a jittery QB.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
yeah
I wonder if that ankle was bothering him before auctally reported. The first 4 games in the 1st half he was to amped and just had to settle down a bit. Now he needs to relax and not be so nervous. the next few weeks will be big for Staff and our team. Leggo!
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
If it was not his ankle it very well could be something else hurting for the last few weeks.
Something knocked off his game. It is his job to pick himself up, dust off his uni and get back to work. We will find out eventually if he has that “it” we all hope he does.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Yeah agree
i auctally thought the pass blocking was decent if not good that game. At first it was terrible(2 sacks in the 1st drive) but they settled down pretty good. I surely hope he has the “it” factor too.
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
I buy most of what you're saying
But the next four games will define his career? He’s played around 18 games. If you pulled strings for the Colts, Peyton Manning would have never happened. Not saying Stafford is Manning, but he’s not necessarily Matt Ryan, lighting the world on fire within his first 16 games.
Fan of the Detroit Tigers, Lions and Red Wings.
But the next four games will define his career?
That comment was taken in the context of having a week off to heal and gather his in the pocket courage. If he does not get his pocket presence under control quickly, I am not sure if it will ever return. Poise under pressure is probably the most important thing a QB can have. Right now, he does not have it.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
I'm not asking you to brush it off, I am saying....
that I believe that some of the reason is inexperience and growing pains as we face good opponents, good defenses and while critical portions of our offense are not clicking as well as they should be. It’s just practical to be able to assume that he’s not going to be lights out all the time this year. I know that practical isn’t you and now that I know you better, it’s illogical for me to assume that you can take something like inexperience into consideration, but the league is full of those types of struggles.
Look at the two other ‘09 QB’s Josh Freeman and Mark Sanchez. Both have good, young offenses around them and yet Sanchez had the ever-loving shit beat out of him against the Ravens and Freeman just threw 4 INTs yesterday. Are they worth nothing too? I’m just simply stating that you have to assume for some of these growing pains from young (23 year old) QBs. I agree that now Stafford is trending downwards and is hitting that mid-year lull when things start getting tough. But I’m not writing him off whatsoever. I’m just much more realistic and far less pessimistic…. and you’re taking Dismal Rd. once again…. go figure.
Are they worth nothing too?
Did I say he was worth nothing? Where did I say anything like that? Even remotely like that?
Yeah, I am not seeing that either. As always, you take anything I say and twist it in the worst possible way.
You want logical. How about how many QBs get happy feet and eventually recover to be elite QBs? I do not remember any that played for the Lions. That is the task in front of Staff right now. Do I think he can do it? Sure do. At this very moment, he looks more like the dozens of scared QBs we have had over the years than the promising QB we all hope he will end up being. Does that doom him to a futile effort for the remainder of his career? No, not even close but it does raise concerns that I addressed in my post above.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
I mean, I see what you're saying, Josh
but really, the reason he’s getting happy feet is because his protection is failing him. I didn’t notice any of that in the first few games, because he had adequate protection. Once he sees that he’s not getting any, he develops into a happy feet type of guy, just like last game. The second drive, I believe it was, he was sacked on first and second down, both within about two seconds. As a young QB, yes he’s still young, that takes a toll on you. He has been great with decent protection, just think about if he has stellar protection.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
As a young QB
He has just a very small sample size to see what he can do. Can he do it? I say yes,
however the line must improve.
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
I agree with the 2 sacks in a row
I think that hurt his poise for the rest of the game. Right near the redzone too.
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
Okay, so chill out.
I was just adding emphasis. You are so touchy, lol. You did not say that, but I was just making a point.
As for the happy feet then not having a good career… absolute poppycock. Peyton Manning had happy feet for a LONG time. Aikman was scattershot worse than any QB I can ever remember early in his career. The solid added pieces around him picked him up. Steve Young in Tampa Bay had to run for his life. It happens all the time. Sorry, but you are flat out wrong here, Joshsun.
I don't think his career is in jeopardy
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
That was for the record
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
ignoring your first comment in an effort for peace, I will say this
You just named 3 QBs that had happy feet early on in their career who developed into elite players. Three, out of how many? I admit, it would be a stretch to think that you or I could remember the beginnings of every QB that has played the game and how they played in their first years relative to their later years.
I can tell you this. The number of elite QBs that evolved from happy feet QBs is far smaller than those that ended up tanking. That is my fear right now and frankly, I think it is a valid concern.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
I think his happy feet are due to his piss poor protection
And that if the FO will do something to improve THAT, he will be fine.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
I hope you are right
The problem, that is not going to be fixed this season. If you are right and his entire problem is our O line. Do you believe he can suffer a full season and come back next year and not be shell shocked?
That is part of my fear. How long can he be beat on before he breaks mentally? Before he passes the point of no return.
As Lions fans, we have seen QBs that crossed that line. More than we would ever like to admit. Do I think he has crossed that line yet? No, but I do not know when the proverbial straw that broke the camels back will happen.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Quite honestly
It’s not likely to be fixed next season either. The last three drafts have been pis – poor in terms of oline prospects. We aren’t likely to solve it with free agents as a result. The vast majority of teams are in the same boat. Currently watching the Ravens – Jags. Both olines suck. Right now no team is gonna let a good olineman go without a helluva effort to resign him.
Someone is alive today simply because I can't afford a hitman.
by Justan Oldfart on Oct 24, 2011 9:59 PM EDT up reply actions
yup
which makes me even more upset and frankly nervous.
I still hate a team getting their QB before they get their O line set. Shell shocked QBs are so common any more. You have to be able to protect young QBs or they are doomed.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
also
we do not have a ton of cap room to sign free agents either.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
I agree with you here Josh
Stafford does suddenly seem VERY nervous…probably because he got beat up pretty good in the two games before San Fran.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
He has taken a good beating
but all QBs take a good beating all the time. His poise, in the face of that beating, is his biggest obstacle right now. That is his next test. If he can get that under control. The sky is the limit for him. If he fails…. I don’t really want to think about it.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
He's not the toughest guy in the world
And he shouldn’t need to be. The front office needs to correct the issues with his protection, making him feel more safe and secure back there. Even if he only FEELS safe, it will make a huge difference.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
The front office needs to correct the issues
I agree. Even in shotgun he has little on some ( most ) plays.
As I said above, he is still a young QB by games played.
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
I agree 100%
That he has time to develop yet.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Thank you
I’m tired of ’Start Hill"! Why? Let Matt learn. If he is healthy he needs to be on the field.
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
Agreed
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Totally Disagree
about the week off. If he can go, he should play period!
Look at the performances vs Denver this yr:
Week 1: Jason Campbell 59% completed pass qb rating 86.4
Week 2: Andy Dalton 66% completed pass qb rating 107
Week 3: Matt Hasselbeck 75% completed pass qb rating 119.1
Week 4: Aaron Rogers 76% completed pass qb rating 134.5
Week 5: Rivers 62% completed pass qb rating 87
Week 7: Matt Moore 67% completed pass qb rating 92.6
I guess I’m in the minority, but I see this game as a confidence booster. Denver’s D is not that good. Stafford can build some momentum and then heal during the bye week.
Nope, you are spot on and this thinking SHOULD be in the majority.
Even though we are on the road, we should be able to get our offensive groove back this week in Denver. It would REALLY help if Stafford were a part of that.
If you're in the minority thinking this....
then…well…..i don’t know
you shouldnt be in the minority.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
Scared....
This is exactly how I fealt when I created the I’M PISSED post! It is not ranting or bashing on Stafford to me. It isn’t even a request to change QB. Ive been reading these posts all day asking us to relax, chill out, and everything is ok with Matt, its more the O-Line. I want to see Matt be who he has shown us to be. I don’t know what it takes for that to happen, but at some point he has to be THE MAN, and play like it. The balls he has been throwing are a MILE away from the hands of his receivers. Watching him early on he was throwing laser beams, the throws just aren’t the same. maybe he is battling an injury!?!?!?
by Suh_me4luvinthelions on Oct 25, 2011 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
you said something about needing a lead blocker
and i agree. I know we dont use a fullback and whatever but with Jahvid out and our running game suffering we might just have to resort to it
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
We should have cloned Cory Schlesinger.
That guy had to be worth a decent chunk of rushing yards and that’s just talking about his contributions lead blocking.
Fan of the Detroit Tigers, Lions and Red Wings.
We should force him out of retirement
What is he 45-50? He could still break a couple noses lol.
All kidding aside, i wish we could have
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
I miss the Slushinger
I used to call him that because he would plow into other players like he was a drunk rhino!
I miss players like him.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Also
The obligatory reference every game about how many facemasks of his he’s smashed versus the Lions’ opponent over the course of the year.
Fan of the Detroit Tigers, Lions and Red Wings.
hell yeah
He was brutal out there. The man was a football player. Tough as nails and ready to dish it out.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Latest uodate from ESPansy
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7144700/detroit-lions-say-matthew-stafford-knee-ok-qb-day-day
"I like to win all the time, so all the time I play with myself."
All I can say is that I NEVER want to see Stafford throw another Sidearm pass.
Fran Tarkenton he ain’t.
One cure for happy feet is taking more snaps under center. It also slows the pass rush a bit.
Nice post, Drew.
This was a good thread....not much to add without repeating what I've said countless times over the last 2 years....
The Oline is ground zero of all of our problems, from the mental health of our QB to the D being on the field way to soon after too many 3 and outs.
Amen
And I couldn’t agree more, brother. I believe the root that ails us begins and ends on the line. I certainly hope we address this glaring issue once and for all next off-season.
2013 Superbowl Champion Detroit Lions
R.I.P Tom Kowalski. You will be sorely missed.
More and more are getting on board, but more then that are getting more vocal and expressing their disgust with the Oline.
Even the radio guys have quit scoffing at callers who express this line of thinking.
Brother, we have been screaming about this for far too long
This is one instance where I really hate to be right. In fact, I would have preferred to be flat out wrong and I am sure you feel the same.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
You were right....
You started pretty early crabbing about the Oline, where as I, even though I agreed with what you were saying still wanted to poopoo it and ignore it so early in the year. I completely underestimated how it would affect every facet of how the Lions play the game.
I especially never thought for a minute that it would have as much effect as it has on Stafford and his game. Happy feet? Come on, not in a million years, but Stafford’s game is F-ed up. If he continues playing as bad as he has, I’d give him until the week after the bye week to get his shit together, after that, he should ride the pine for awhile.
I was on the O-line is okay for now side
But I am taken back a bit how fast it has deteriorated. I mean the last 6 weeks of last season the Lions could run the ball. I am starting to look at Linehan for the problems this season.
Yooperlionfan is officially "the man"
the Lions D-Line: the Four Horsemen of the A-sack-alypse
Jim Schwartz: Erasing the stink of Millen, one fist pump at a time.
P.C.P: It is not just for recreation anymore.
I hear ya.....I'm going to have to rethink my views that he's a top 5 OC here soon if he doesn't get this straightened out soon. We went through this same O funk last season also.
starting to look at Linehan for the problems this season.
Sweet post Drew!
I agree with you on pretty much every point concerning Matthew Stafford. It is so easy to be impatient. I know that I have to rein myself in at times. I get rolling down the emo train one way or the other and it is so easy to get carried away.
Listen to the Two Bro's Talk podcast!
Follow @tufflynx
I do too, Tuff.... especially during the games.
I was really hollering at Stafford during the game, but I could also see things breaking down around him as well. Patient is the hardest thing to be as a fan.
I just ooze patients, it's my strong suit......lol
Schwartz isn’t sounding very thrilled with the play calling the last two games. He’s not out and out hanging Linehan, and he’s doing the Schwartz dance when asked about it, but he’s not giving any ringing endorsements either.
I expect a more uptempo open offense this week in DEN.
Great post Drew
One of my biggest pet peeves about Stafford’s game has been the fact that he doesn’t do a good job of moving his feet in the pocket. Its either he stands there or rushes out of the pocket and tries to make a play. I think Shaun Hill needs to teah him how to move around IN the pocket
House of Spears | My Detroit Lions/NFL Blog
Follow @THouseOfSpears
Good Post Drew
I like the realistic view of what has been happening lately. Personally, I would like to see more formations that include Heller as a lead blocker. It’s pretty obvious to me that we need more help in the middle. Tight ends lined up on the line of scrimmage do nothing for the middle of the line. Of course, they could pass from this formation as well to keep the defenses honest. I don’t understand why we don’t use thia more often. Just my 2 cents.
2013 Superbowl Champion Detroit Lions
R.I.P Tom Kowalski. You will be sorely missed.
the lions our 5and 2 and stafford has ben a soild qcb for the lions has he done will the last few game no ask your shelf why ?. want has changed the game plan has in the lions win s the offensive game plan was to pass the foot ball to all the wrsand te and sea witch one hand the hot hand and yes they did try to run the ball but it was afftear stafford had goten in to the pass game . the lions coaching staf f has change it game plan beacuse it think s the lions offensive line cant protect stafford with teams with a wining recored and try to use the runing game to set up the pass the proleam is with that game plan is you have to have a offensive line who is good at run blocking and a full back to run that game . the lions do nt have a true full back on roster and the offensive sucks at run blocking it best at pass blocking and the lions should go back to the pass to set up the run game plan and ithink the lions will sarto win some football game also it might help if heller helpout the ot who drawes the best de pass block it might give stafford more time to pass the ball .
We have all been begging for a few more chip blocks from the TEs and RB on the way out
I still can’t figure out why this is not happening more. Honestly, it is astounding.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Off topic but
i think we lack a true 4th wide reciever(not tight end or running back)
Bernard Berrian just got released and i wonder if he will return back to chicago. Should we pick him up at, obvisuly, the right price? Stovall has been non exsistent and Berrian is a good player. not suggesting it just wonder what yall think
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
a true 4th wide reciever
Last year, we talked about how we lack a true 3rd WR
Progress
House of Spears | My Detroit Lions/NFL Blog
Follow @THouseOfSpears
Are we sure we have a true WR3?
It is still really early on TY right now and he has shown flashes but that role he plays, IMHO, is about the deep threat. That is contrary to the typical role of a WR2 and WR3 who are often the possession WRs. The guys that can almost always be relied on to be open in the 6-8 yard range for a first down.
Do we have that guy? I am not sure we do ATM. I am talking about a Brett Perriman type of WR. That is what this offense needs right now or at least that is how I see it.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
I think...
Burleson is a true slot receiver, and Titus could serve well as one…IF they would utilize him properly in space, and not try to turn him into Devery Henderson with the all or nothing BS. Give the ball to Burleson and Young in space, underneath or behind the LBers, and see what they can do.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
You hit my senitiment exactly
I have not seen Burleson running enough underneath routes. Have him run just deeper than the LBs, but in front of the safeties (there should be plenty of space if Calvin and Titus are running deeper routes) to get an easy catch and let him work his YAC magic. Don’t force the players to do things they are not as good at, work to the strengths of your players.
We've got four receiving tight ends and have an A+ receiving RB
I’m not in love with the idea of with another receiver just for the sake of having a fourth receiver that’s designated as a WR on a depth chart.
My main question is “why?” I know we don’t have a fourth WR, but we can spread five wide quite well as it is. Hell, if it were NFL legal we could send eight wide.
"You've got to respect your opponent, no matter who it is. You respect him best by going out there and beating him up." - Calvin Johnson
by Mavyrk on Oct 25, 2011 10:08 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I knew someone would mention the TEs
I almost mentioned them in by post above and to an extent I agree. But (there is always a but) I do not see them as possession players. When I mentioned Perriman, I was thinking about that guy that can get open on the outside for those 6-8 yard catches. TY Nate actually should fit this mold really well. They are small, fast and shifty.
I just do not see them being used this way and it confuses me.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
In Schwartz speak, our TE's are part of our running game now, and I don't mean for their blocking skills.
We have injected big risk into the O(and it has showed with the number of 3 and outs) by thinking 4-5 yard passes will take the place of a handoff.
It may be a conflict of opinion.
You may not see the TEs in that mold but the coaches clearly do; and clearly they value inside possession receivers on crossing routes over the outs; this scheme loves to own the middle of the defense for some reason.
It was always clear to me that TD wasn’t brought in to be a Wes Welker type; obviously he could be that type, he could probably be the best Welker since Welker, but it’s clear they want him as more of a DeSean Jackson type of receiver. And I’m okay with that, because Best is a good Welker type on his own.
"You've got to respect your opponent, no matter who it is. You respect him best by going out there and beating him up." - Calvin Johnson
As Stafford has gotten gotten skittish, his ability to even throw these type of passes has suffered.
If he completes them, he’s throwing them in a poor location with no chance for the receiver to make kind of YAC, where even passes of this nature have turned into an adventure, and it shows.
Even still, if they are relying on this short pass as a staple of the O, where’s Titus on short quick slants? Nate’s slightly involved, but not by much.
Even still this is a major deception by Schwartz who has veered sharply from his stated goal of “being able to run the ball in Soldier and Lambeau Fields in December”. They can’t run the ball and it’s because they have spent too many assets on skill players and not enough on lineman, so now Schwartz is talking this shit as being a big part of the O because that’s all he has for short yardage.
yup
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
LOL, and i'm a Schwartz fan boy....but I don't like to be bullshitted, and Schwartz is trying to pull a fast one here.
In all my years of watching football, and listening to coach speak, I have never heard of short passes as being as described as being equal to and as a satisfactory replacement for a team trying to run the ball.
If a coach is trying to sell to a fan base that this is the same as a ball control, clock eating run game, then he’s taking the fan base as a bunch of fools, and opposing teams are licking their lips at the prospects of the Lions using this as a replacement for an adequate running game.
Good luck Stafford, because your going to see 4 man rushes and 7 dropping back into coverage forcing you to hold on the ball just a tad longer then you like and your going to be getting killed behind that line, if this is Schwartz’s big hope for a running game for this season.
If they would run some quick hitters...
Short ins, drags, digs, dumps etc…to players OTHER than Calvin Johnson and Brandon Pettigrew, and sprinkle in some screens, then a short passing game COULD replace a running game…just like Green Bay and Chicago do all the time.
However, with the game planning and play calling we have seen, I would say you are absolutely right here.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Yup, the play calling has been horribly bad and plain as of late.
I just can’t believe a team can function for long at above .500 with what were passing off as a running game, even with a short yardage passing game to take it’s place.
GB is just an unusual team in an unusual situation with the #1 QB in the league. Chicago, they’ve come back to where they belong.
It's more about blocking than the backs though...IMO
At least in Detroit…
However, Green Bay’s offensive line is nothing special…they just have a QB who isn’t afraid to run the ball. In his own words, “I run the ball occasionally, just to prove that I actually am somewhat of an athlete too”.
Nobody can convince me that the Lions do NOT have what it takes to do the same thing the Packers are doing, UNLESS you want to come at it from the standpoint that Matthew Stafford is nowhere near as good as Aaron Rodgers.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
Rodgers is more athletic than Stafford
But that’s about it. In time, I think we’ll see those two be considered the guideline for success for QB’s in the NFL
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
I think he has top 5 talent, what has taken place here has completely caught me off guard with him.
Matthew Stafford is nowhere near as good as Aaron Rodgers.
at this time this year....
Stafford isn’t as good as Rodgers, but nobody is right now.
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
I'm just saying...
That’s about the only argument I could accept, as to why the Lions can’t do the same thing the Packers are doing. Stafford is developing still, and clearly at this point in his career he can not measure up to Rodgers.
Will he eventually be as good as Rodgers? Maybe. However, I think the front office is going to have to get him some better protection if he will ever have a hope to get there.
Check out my new blog, The Mane Attraction, featuring TCLion and I as authors, home of the Weekend Spotlight, and much more!
yeah ik thats true
As i said in my comment i was trying not to include them. I dont know how davis is at recieving, cuz i just havent seen him. Again im not suggesting it
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
I'm not sure what to think of Ty
at this stage/ It is however clear that Matt and he have not developed much “chemistry” for lack of a better word. I don’t think it’s all on Ty though/ At least on that long sideline pass in the Atlanta game TY made the correct decision to pull up and Matt incorrectly chose to lead him.
Someone is alive today simply because I can't afford a hitman.
by Justan Oldfart on Oct 25, 2011 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions
yup
I also think we need to use him for more than deep throws. Right now, he is a one dimensional player and teams plan for that. He was most effective when he was going over the middle too (something he did more early in the season! BTW).
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Plus...
he has had little time to develop any type of chemistry with him at all….
President of the Eric Wright fan club.
Obligatory statement about being a huge Lions fan.
I have a twitter: Follow Me
Hello everyone and fuck Mark Sanchez count: 40
agreed
That is something that will take care of itself with time. Until then, Linny needs to set TY and Nate up for more of the “mid” or “intermediate” throws. Slants and such. Those will loosen up the outside for the deep routes.
I like Wins, Cheese and I also Like Cookies. If you don't. Wow. :P
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It’s modern-day slavery, you know?" Adrian Peterson (AKA, The $11 million dollar slave)
Help Stop real slavery!
Adrian Peterson facing reality and trying to help!
Those are exactly the plays
that I want to see the TE’s chipping or staying home to block. Let these playes develop.
It's turkey, Lions and Macy's. Any other combination is just ludicrous.
"Only a real man quotes himself in the 3rd person" - Nate D. circa 2011
"Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy." - Charlie McCarthy
Yeah i aslo think
its way to early to judge him. I mean we have options everywhere so TY “numbers” might not look great.
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
o yea i agree
Progress progress progress.
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
O he'll run
and i think we just need to get out to a big of lead as possible. Tim can comeback from any margin i swear so we need to get out of the gates fast and protect Matt. Von Miller and Elvis Duemrville will be comin on a hunt so we need to block them.
R.I.P Al Davis
Thank you Kris Draper and Chris Osgood for all the memories.
Millen shall be Mi**en on Pride of Detriot. New, official, unwritten law
"We gonna bust our ass, from sideline to sideline,
goalpost to goalpost, for 4 *beep**beep* quarters"
-Nate Buleson leading the pregame chant
Not sure if this was mentioned
but the one thing i thought was weird, was at the end of the 49ers game. Where was the urgency? Stafford was crawling to the line, and overall they had a lackadaisical attitude toward the game with that little time left.
Does anyone have any insight to this?
Other than that. Stafford is still pretty much a rookie. Healthy, this guy is going to be special
This message will self destruct

by 
























